322 thoughts on “Gerard Baden-Clay Committal Hearing Thread Part VI

      • yes :) But despite dipping out I hope those who read the blog from the web will find it easier to find posts. I have never liked web email and the like. I even have hotmail and gmail accounts come into my email client (Windows Live Mail) lol.

        • Have performed a little magic Ozmo, just for you… lol

          Millie – Am awaiting an answer re Apple and their iPhones, however I think the answer to your “coincidence” may be related to instant messaging messages – that would appeal to their ‘secretive messages’ routine.

          • lol MM, too funny ;) I wasn’t going to sook about it but thanks, hee hee. I once won a game of dominoes against my 6 yr old son, I am so ashamed….

              • He is winning now, he got his licence this week and as he is 18 I can’t stop him driving everywhere. Last night he finished worked at 10 and didn’t come straight home or tell me (telling me is a sorta “rule” at the moment due to his inexperience) and it was raining. So after a few exchanged text messages at 11.30 pm and a few WTF’s mum!, I had to give in and just worry in bed for hours, lol. Thank goodness he is the 6th of the 7 kids to get his licence. My seventh has Downs and will never drive, so this is pretty much my last major worrying experience.

  1. What about this bit in the diary entries above:
    “Pictures – Large portrait
    – with her!
    -40th birthday – 4 wks later. started.”
    Was the portrait a gift for TMcH? For her 40th? (I can’t remember how old Ol’ Tone is).

    • Maybe they are a mish mash of thoughts, not in a timeline. I read the birthday thing as being a good time in her life but that GBC started his affair only 4 weeks after that. Sorta like a husband cheating straight after a momentous occasion like a wedding or birth of a child. She would be trying trying to reconcile in her mind how he can appear happy and loving towards her but start an affair soon after. By 2010 she was writing about wanting to be loved and made love to. Oh how I wish she had dumped the cad back then :( But not appearing to be a failure would have been pretty high in her priorities back then as well as her still being in love with him.

      • Thanks Oz, I always appreciate your sound reasoning. Cynical me also thinks that reference in her diary where she is thankful that he booked her in til 2pm (late checkout) so she could enjoy the morning is actually him having the opportunity to liaise with Ol’ Tone. Cynical, I know.

          • Agreed Caro, Allison and GBC were not on the same page, it almost looks as if they never were. She had doubts about whether marrying him was the right thing to have done – in retrospect it seems not. She sacrificed her career, and suffered much unhappiness as a result. Perhaps to him she was a trophy wife at the time that he married her, but he got bored and wanted out. In hindsight divorce definitely would have been the solution. I suspect on 19/4 Allison realised that, and likely said she would be starting proceedings the next day, which could have precipitated her murder to take place that night before she could relay this to anyone, if plans were afoot to claim her life insurance before 30 June.

            It does look as if plan A was to drive her to commit suicide (which OW also already tried to allude to in their early joint media interview…she’s depressed….) The portrait/s of GBC and TM, the nightly ‘vent and grill’ sessions detailing intimate details of the lovers’ interactions, and criticising the most intimate of Allison’s supposed shortcomings were all very cruel and abusive, seemingly intended to inflict max emotional pain and stress on her. He may have gone all out that night and even mentioned their love nest in the office! Must have been revulsive to her but perhaps also finally gave her the strength to decide she does not want to spend a single day further under the same roof as this man.

            I suspect he underestimated her. She was made of strong stuff, and things likely did not go to plan when instead of committing suicide as may have been hoped she would, she threatened to start divorce proceedings first thing the next day. What the murderer did not understand is that Allison had far too much to live for, in spite of the emotional trauma he had caused her. She had a lot of inner strength, she had faith, she would have had the support of her loving family and 3 beautiful girls to live for. If she left him she would have recovered emotionally and been infinitely happier without him.

            MM as for where she was murdered, since plant material from her patio and garden were found entangled in her hair, it appears at some point her body was dragged over or placed in her patio area. With her blood having dripped down into her Captiva, she must have been transported in that whilst immobilised in some way or shortly after death. But whether she was killed at home and transported in her Captiva afterwards, or whether she drove off to a friend/family/police or to confront TM and was intercepted somewhere and killed in some quiet spot (muffled scream heard near Rafting Ground road?), then transported back home in her Captiva to be cleaned since she must have been bloody and dressed in her ‘walking gear’, is not clear.

            Perhaps someone racing after her and catching up with her at the traffic circle, people getting out of their cars and yelling at each other…..who knows?? Hopefully the cameras caught some of the action and other drivers would have seen some of what transpired at the traffic circle and come forward.

            Once cleaned up and dressed and no longer bleeding she could have been transported to Kholo bridge in another car – perhaps rolled in a tarpaulin or the like in the back of a white or blue one….possibly left no trace??? Were the white and blue cars sighted involved? If so did one or both drive through the traffic circle in the early morning hours??? One wonders how many times BC related vehicles went through that circle during that night…?? It clearly worried GBC enough for him to ask Flegg about the cameras….

            There is of course also the rumour of NBC supposedly having been seen sitting at the bus stop in the traffic circle late on 19/4…if this is true this too will be very telling, but it is merely rumour at this point.

            I still can’t discount TM’s possible involvement. Time and trial will tell… She may well have sent emails (written ‘evidence, very handy just like GBC’s Love G texts), seemingly suggesting post separation childcare arrangements with Allison, but I would not put it past her to have deliberately left this ‘evidence’ to divert investigators from her trail…..she may have been aware of the plan to do away with Allison, may even have helped hatch the plan, and could have helped execute it. I am not sure about her – she pursued GBC with a vengeance and hated Allison…..could have had means, motive and opportunity…..during the trial will we hopefully learn the truth.

            With all this going on at the house for hours during the night, which clearly the dogs in the neighbourhood sensed and reacted to with agitation, one wonders if those kids could possibly have been home and NOT heard/seen anything…..??? Did they sleep at skull manor that night? The fact that GBC took the lovers portraits home to show Allison, even drew a floor plan of TM’s home in her journal, makes it seem as if he had decided to go all out that night.

            Judging by the large array of wounds GBC received that night, IMO he was definitely her primary attacker. Did someone come to assist him with the final task, cleaning and dressing her? It seems likely it would have required 2 people to place her body UNDER the Kholo bridge. Who assisted there, possibly in a blue car…..NBC or TM….???

            Is it possible that when divorce came up and it looked like discussions would get heated that evening, Allison may have called OW and asked her to fetch them so she and GBC could discuss these weighty issues without the kids overhearing?? Was OW not the last person Allison called on 19/4…..???

            • Thank you RIP… The talk of immunity – was it rumour or fact, do we know? It was the DPP whisking TM away after the hearing that prompted me to look more closely into her actions. They weren’t just being kind. I think there is more to come.

              • IMO we don’t – because as the journalist/politician said: ‘if the CMC is involved we will never know’. However, ‘where there is smoke, there is fire’. Courts and the legal world have nothing to do with being kind. If they whisk someone away, that person is a witness and therefore of interest to their case IMO.

            • RIP, I love your analysing of all the finer details…you hardly miss anything, love reading your posts….
              Do you recall something of the neighbour seeing GBC wandering around in the backyard and them actually speaking or something of that nature in the early hours of the morning? Or was that just rumour? I have been wondering about this and will try to find where I read that over the week-end……

              • I think toooo…I am tending to agree that Allison may have come to harm in the captiva and then some kind of transference going on. Man there are sooo many possibilities….but some link together more than others….we just have to find that stronger link…. sheesh it’s so bloody hard. But there is a strong link, we just haven’t figured it yet….I know it….I just know..we are missing something…

                • Was support crew for a friend competing his horse at Brookfield Show today. Bit eery. Beautiful day but can’t help but feel there is something eery hanging in the air. Stayed on for the rodeo tonight.

                  Of course Allison’s last home being across the road, visiting the art pavilion and the first name I saw on a plaque supporting a category was ‘Dr Bruce Flegg, Member for Moggill, the kids from Brookfield school attending in class levels (couldn’t help but wonder what sort of zone the girls are in these days), driving home late (looked at the time and it was around 11.30pm) and crossing Kholo Creek. I wonder what side of the road the cars were parked that night….only 2 spots before the bridge (either side of the road) where vehicles could actually stop and park.

                  There was discussion among the group I was with about the diminished crowd the year and whether Allison’s murder had impacted the community and that things had ‘changed’. One person commented ‘Brookfield holds a lot of secrets’. Hopefully, one day, some of the secrets will be revealed, especially about the Hamburger Man.

                  • I just have to say, I wish Rodeos were outlawed.

                    I hate watching the horses poked so they’ll buck and everyone cheer.

                    It is awful, I refuse to go on a Friday night due to this.

                    Little Fish, how did your friend go? What classes did he enter?

                    • Yeah funny things those rodeos. At Brookfield, they call it a rodeo but it is a bull-ride which many would object to also. From where I sit, I see it is the bull that wins. I wonder if they could think in human terms, whether the bulls would be grateful for the fact that they hadn’t been deknackered, get a night out every now and again under the spotlight, get fed well to be healthy and don’t become our dinner while they continue to buck :-) .

                      In general, The cows fare better than the boys as if they are good breeders, they get to stay on earth until around 10 years of age, whereas the boys, unless they look like they are studs, and retain their testicles, leave green (well, more often than not, brown) pastures for our dinner plate after a couple of years.

                      Said horse that I was watching yesterday should not be around either, as it was saved from being turned into glue. She competed against many high brow, expensive money guzzling ponies, and came out with some blue ribbons and a red. Her first outing so not bad, but couldn’t tell you the class sorry….

                      Very brave boys are those bull riders, not to mention the rodeo clowns who also risk their lives to keep them safe. Pity sometimes that human beings don’t take such care with their fellow human beings hey?

    • RB – re “40th birthday – 4 wks later. started.” Translation:
      Allison turned the big 40 on 1st July 2008 – then 4 wks after Allison’s birthday the affair with TM started August 2008.
      TM left her de facto in November 2008.

      • Left the defacto to be with GBC forever no doubt. I doubt he ever had intentions to actually be with her. She was the easy sex, diversion for him. So no happy ever after for Ms MH.

      • Thanks, MMisst. What a lousy cad (GBC). TM’s de facto must be wiping the sweat from his brow these days, thankful to be free of her.

  2. Reading Allison’s diary entries just breaks my heart. So personal, so raw, such ugly goings on behind the scenes. They were not written for public consumption. It makes you wonder as we go about our daily lives, what is going on for people around us that we are unaware of. For me, it makes me just want to listen that little bit more. Perhaps this is Allison’s legacy.

    • Sad for Allison, I completely agree with you. The entire thing is just so sad but reading a portion of the diary makes it even more so. You just don’t know what others are dealing with at any given time. They should have called everything off a long time ago probably but that’s easy to say when you don’t have children, they did and three little girls. I don’t know about anyone else but the diary doesn’t make nice reading, its just so sad. It seems like everyone was torn and nobody could make much sense of anything. A very dangerous position for everyone to be in one would assume.

      • The way I read it Allison was focused on her marriage, and saving it. GBC, I don’t think he was torn, he just had his own agenda (greed, lust, pleasing his parents, living up to his family name etc). The saddest thing is I don’t believe Allison, who was an intelligent woman, had any inkling that the situation was dangerous for her. I had three children and walked out of a marriage, having no idea how I would manage financially. Different things drive different people. The sad thing is Allison never had the opportunity to decide what was best for her and her children.

        • His continued deception made it difficult for her to discern e.g. in response to her query about putting the seats down in Snowy he said:”you have nothing to worry about”. He continued his relationship with TMcH at the same time. Total disregard for her IMO.

    • It makes me cringe. I would hate for anyone to read my diaries. As you say, SfA, it is raw and personal. And yes, listening is a gift you can give, and sometimes that is all that is required. To be heard.

        • Nor to me, moonlight. She strikes me as someone who perhaps wouldn’t have attracted much attention from the opposite sex, so when GBC looked twice at her she fell for it, hard. I find her behaviour over the top. . .the constant phone calls for a start. I see a tightly wound-up woman, desperate and clingy.

          • Didn’t MM post something about this on her blog, with regards to GBC and his relationship with his mother? I feel sure it touches on his relationship with women in general, and his inability to stand alone without his parents. I must go back and re-read that as it resonated with me at the time, how GBC ‘functioned’ and acted out his life. I remember that it seemed very unhealthy and dysfunctional.

          • He HAD someone at home who wanted to love him and be loved in return. And three daughters who loved them both. Some people just don’t know what they have. . . .until it’s gone. What monumental, distastrous, deadly decisions he made.

            • Must say, I have little knowledge & struggle with understanding astrology, but look for the main message in the article.Very interesting.
              Extrapolating, it seems Allison paid the price for Gerbil’s stunted inner world & she became the victim; with all this going on in Gerbil’s inner world, ‘his’ own inner space was never allowed to develop. It was overshadowed by mother and father’s images & wishes. He was required to perform for others from an early age.
              This means that there could be no genuine attachment from Gerbil to build upon. He was still ‘stuck’ in his primary relationships which were directing his life. IMHO this man was unsuitable for marriage. How can one have a genuine relationship with another when one does not know oneself? Allegedly Allison started placing some boundaries around their failing marriage following the discovery of the affair; but then TMcH added pressure & started calling the shots in the affair relationship as well. Pressure all around and no escape.
              It just goes to show that what may look like a good relationship with one’s parents, may not be; and what may look like a failing marriage may not be, because it is overcrowded with others within it’s boundaries, taking up the ‘space’ the marriage needs to grow. So the marriage could not find its own space to grow either. It had fractured. IMO this is symbolized by the ‘rental’ accommodation, lack of their own place. Even their ‘identity’ was attached to the BC Snr’s – rather than have their own identity as a family. What a ‘fractured’ mess Gerbil’s inner world was. Just some hypotheticals for a Sunday morning.

              .

                • This post of yours MM http://astrologyincrime.com/category/baden-clay/allison-victim/ on gives some further insight into GBC’s relationship with his mother, sister and mistress. It’s interesting to read again, especially what drives NBC who has slipped into the background and seems to present to the world a different face to who she is behind the scenes in the family.

                  I agree so much with what you write about OW, I feel she is looking at some type of breakdown in the future as she must be under a huge amount of stress. And yes, TMH was used but also played a huge catalyst role in Allison’s demise. Very interesting stuff, thanks for all your input MM it’s really invaluable.

                  • I wonder if assessments for ‘personality disorder’ have been conducted in the main players? Clearly posters are using terms like ‘dysfunctional’ relationships, but what usually drives these is some kind of personality disorder as well. These labels are just ways of categorizing to be able to identify & understand the nature of the beast.

                    Despite all the psychiatric/psychological labelling, MURDER is murder. These people acted, with adult capacity and adult free will – to end the life of another person, a mother of three little children, for their own perceived gain.

                    Did they ‘conspire’ together? There seems to be a degree of ‘calculation’ before/after the fact IMHO.

                    They are accountable under the Law of this land for what they have done.

      • I agree there about anyone, others, the world having access to my private and intimate thoughts. Poor Allison. I feel like a thief in the night stealing a part of her away in reading them.

        I have banged on about this in the past, but I still feel there is something odd or not quite right about the journal entries.

        • I agree with you, Little Fish, my gut feeling yells at me when I read them; however, I can’t put my finger on why.

          Perhaps it is just that they are private, and that is why, I really don’t know.

          • If others had access to her diary, then it wasn’t private. GBC allegedly had acess to it evidenced by the drawing of TMcH’s house plan. WHO ELSE HAD ACCESS TO iT? Unknown to Allison? Who was allegedly found trawling through Allison’s jewellery when she was deemed only ‘a missing person’ at that stage?

            • Well, technically, you could say that her journal wasn’t private, however I am saying that no matter what, I doubt very much that Allison would have thought for one moment while writing that her words would be available for the world to see…..so sad.

              Theoretically, such a document could be considered private – written in your own home, in your own time, in your own words (hopefully – this is where I have some doubts), for your own information…. not shared in letter form, electronic or any other means.

              Perhaps in hindsight, I should have used the word ‘intimate’. Yes. That might fit better here. Writing is therapy, and I doubt any living human being would write intimately, with the intention of it being aired, if it were for that purpose.

              Private. That is what we hear of Allison. Her extraordinary strength in keeping inside all that had happened, except for the privilege of the counsellor with whom she shared, is testament to her desire to remain, well, ‘private’.

              It is the terminology in the journal that intrigues me….. ‘my partner’, for example.

              • When I read Allison’s diary, the use of her words make me question the purpose for her writing them. They give the impression of being written in line with a counsellor’s guidance and instructions. Most of us wouldn’t write like that in a ‘normal’ situation. Word like ‘why’, making lists of what upsets her, use of time-frames etc. I feel sure the latest entries at least were written while attending marriage guidance counselling. How soul-less of GBC, attending at least some of these sessions, while behind the scenes having a portrait taken with TMcH and letting his baser nature take priority in the background. It is chilling to realise her entries on 18/4/2012 were the day prior to her life ending.

                To be honest, I can’t get my head around GBC having a purpose, of pushing Allison to the brink of suicide. I think that was the way he operated and treated Allison, he was just a nasty narcissistic human being. My gut feeling about GBC is a man who is callous and malicious behind closed doors and thinks only of himself without consequences, and had treated his wife this way for many years. Allison found out about TMcH, but that did nothing to alter his relationship with Allison but push the affair further underground. I doubt very much that he ever spared a thought for what he was doing to his family – Allison or his three daughters.

                The hypocracy of his comments to Allison like ‘I’m sorry you feel that way’ (about using the family car Snowy), is so demeaning in the light of her angst about what he was getting up to behind her back, and just beggars belief. Even if he didn’t murder her, he sure was up there with the most appalling husbands out there.

                Her words ‘let me believe it was all my fault and therefore I was at your mercy’ and ‘Forced me to look to you – think that’s where you wanted me’ show the level of psychological abuse and control she was subjected to. Text book stuff for those who have been through it. ‘Still get sick in stomach’ – who could feel otherwise? I can’t help but think of Allison’s parents’ gut-wrenching grief when they read their daughter’s words.

                • It would be really interesting to see a psych report on GBC. This may not be of interest to some, however, in trying to understand Allison’s situation, how it got to where it was (prior to her untimely and savage death) living under the same roof as a man who would have crushed her emotionally and spiritually slowly over the years (and perhaps more expediently towards the end of her life), I have tried to understand who he was, what made him tick, so to speak.

                  Apart from learning recently that some individuals are born without a conscience, it is simply amazing and alarming, that a human being can have a facade capable of tricking many, and only the most intimate person in their life (namely a spouse as I suspect the parents of an odd child/adult may not see the traits, due to them being inherited and therefore ‘normal’) knows the truth of the matter. Anyone in Allison’s situation would begin to doubt, at times, their own sanity, due to the external public persona of their partner (especially if they have positions of trust in the community ie school, business networks, and rub shoulders with senior government officials etc). The devil inside would only come out while inside the marital home possibly.

                  Just exploring different ways to understand what drives a human being, or makes them capable of repulsively mistreating their spouse, the mother of their children etc and ultimately perhaps be capable of violence and murder. Animalistic. Are these traits a nurture/nature combination? What comes first the chicken or the egg? How can individuals be created to possess such callous capacity?

                  Excerpt from “Counselling for Asperger Couples”, Barrie Thompson, Jessica Kingsley Publishers, UK, 2008.

                  Pages 54-55.
                  Stage Four: Acknowledging Different Perspectives

                  “Cassandra phenomenon”
                  I want to conclude this chapter by giving some recognition to a debilitating condition that can be experienced by the spouses of people with AS (often at the hands of family members, friends and colleagues), that is referred to as the Cassandra phenomenon. I think the following quote from the Families of Adults Affected by Asperger Syndrome (FAAAS) website (www.faaas.org/doc.php?40) aptly explains the naming of this syndrome.

                  I ended up feeling that no one would listen to me and came up with a name for the ‘syndrome’ that affects the non-AS spouse: The CASSANDRA PHENOMENON, Cassandra being the Greek mythological character who was given the gift of prophecy, but also the curse of having no one believe her even though she was right! (Anonymous, Massachusetts, 1999).

                  It is usually both a blessing and a relief when an NT spouse learns about AS (perhaps from a magazine article or a TV programme) and feels she now has an explanation for her husband’s unusual behavious. But it is demoralizing and extremely frustrating if the AS husband rejects her theory out of hand. Imagine then, as a next step the NT spouse seeks support from the extended family; ‘Perhaps mum-in-law might be able to give me some childhood history of my husband?’ She optomistically thinks this might help, only to be told quite firmly, ‘There’s nothing wrong with my son, I suggest you look a bit closer to home!’ Not only have the NT spouse’s hopes been dashed with regard to gaining support from her mother-in-law, but the relationship between herself and all of her in-laws has probably now been seriously damaged and even more tension may be generated at home between her and her husband.
                  Still intent on gaining credibility for the theroy that her husband exhibits Asperger-type behaviour, she then seeks the support of people in her and her husband’s social network. The problem here might be that the AS husband (assuming the wife’s theory is indeed correct), is one of those ‘chameleon-like’ people that can fit in reasonably well in certain situations. A typical type of response in these circumstances from the NT spouse’s friend might then be, ‘I think he’s a little different to other men, but I think that’s kind of cute. I don’t think he’s as bad as you are making out.’ Ironically, it may have been the ‘cute difference’ that initially attracted the NT partner to her AS spouse when they first met!
                  No way forward here, then for our NT partner as people outside the relationship only see a limited part of the AS man. They don’t experience him in an emotional context, they don’t witness his rituals, his routines or his inflexible lifestyle that occur for the most part within the confines of the home. FAAAS gave further credence to this problem in 19977 (1997 kr) when they described it thus:

                  FAAAS came up with the term “Mirror Syndrome” to explain the way NT spouses and the NT family members adversely affected by AS behaviors, over time, begin to reflect the persona of AS behaviours we live with, twenty-four seven. We are isolated, no one validates us, we lose friends and family, and we feel like ‘hostages’ in our own homes. (FAAAS website)

                  My reasons for drawing attention to this condition, be it named Cassandra phenomenon or Mirror Syndrome, is to let NT partners who are in this plight know that their situation is recognised. It is known that loneliness, anxiety and depression can result when they try to tell people about their AS situation, but they ar not listened to to or are thought of as being melodramatic or even paranoid. I also hope that family members, friends and colleagues may in future take notice and be more prepared to hear what ‘Cassandra’ has to say.”

            • Hmmm…I think also the last person Allison phoned on the night of 19/5…..was it for help of some sort….. for self or taking kids away to shield them from an ugly fight??? I suspect this person knew exactly where Allison was right form the start……One wonders, was her presence there that night and the role she has played since planned and intentional?

              • WOW…this post was in response to Caro’s way up: “Who was allegedly found trawling through Allison’s jewellery when she was deemed only ‘a missing person’ at that stage?”….it looks completely out of context now! :o

  3. “My tireless parents and their tireless, unconditional love.”

    Yes yes yes, God bless them and what incredible souls they must be. To be dealt a hand so cruel they certainly deserve justice.

  4. Plant material in the hair. . .fisticuffs/violent scuffle in the backyard? And then somebody supposedly roared off in a car. Allison?

  5. Reading the above Diary Entries is so saddening. It tells me of a caring women being subjected to relentless mental torture by her husband, of having forgiven his earlier indiscretions, and of feeling betrayed yet again.

    I am left thinking that GBC was deliberately trying to push Allison over the edge in terms of her mental well being. It appears, upon considering the diary entries in isolation (i.e. without taking into account his dire financial state, and enquiries regarding the Life Assurance Policies), almost as if he couldn’t bring himself to advise her that the marriage was over, and wanted her to reach that conclusion and take the decision to leave him.

    I suspect Allison did take that decision on the evening of April 19, and rather than just leaving quitely, she made the mistake of telling him what an @#$&hole he was, that she was going to the Conference regardless of His or Jezebels wishes, that she was going to Leave him and take the Girls with her, File for Divorce, and tell the whole world about his tawdry affair, and Mr Top Citizen could not allow that to happen.

    • I have to agree. With the zoloft strategically placed in the car, the immediate claim of depression, the emphasis that she visited professionals for help and then his visit to drs trying to get his story documented and who knows probably even an eventual claim of trying to defend myself, heaven only knows. One thing is for certain that poor women was subjected to emotional torture like no person on this earth should be. She had every right to call him a first class @#$&hole!

      And her phone is missing, WHY?

  6. Where is the information regarding Allison asking for a divorce on the evening of 19 April? I seem to have missed this OR is this an assumption? I am certain that she was pretty p+_)ed off but I don’t know where it states she wanted a divorce? There is little doubt that GBC was a weazil throughout this entire saga and his actions were completely shameless along with TMcH’s. I would think that A would have got to the point where she would just do whatever she wanted to do and what the hell what the others thought. It was all so much for her and so unfair.

    • Hi Witchetad

      There was some references in evidence submitted at the trial hearings of Allison having made it clear to GBC at some earlier time that it would cost him dearly if he did not toe the line, and the Sod appeared to have complied, but was still finding sneaky ways to continue communicating with Jezebel.

      I understood that what Allison had made clear to GBC at this earlier time was that if he made the wrong decision (Between Allison and Jezebel), it would cost him dearly, which I presume meant a Divorce and very expensive Settlement.

      On reading the Diary Entries, it appears to me that GBC was torturing Allison, trying to push her to the limit, perhaps in the hope that she would become sufficiently depressed to commit suicide.

      I am only surmising that Allison threatened to carry out her threat to “Cost him Dearly” upon learning of his ongoing communication with Jezebel who had manipulated GBC into telling Allison that she (Jezebel) would be at the Conference, and that GBC could not allow Allison to walk out, and undermine any chance of him getting an Insurance Payout, so he took matters into his own hands and strangled her then and there.

    • I think it is an assumption Witchetad. No one can know for certain what was said on 19/4, but clearly something GBC said and/or showed her (directly or said TM does NOT want her to attend conference, showed her portrait/s of the two lovers, etc) likely made it very clear that the affair was ongoing and it seems likely her tolerance would have run out and she would not have wanted to be with him any longer. Announcing a separation the next morning would have cut GBC out of her will, so if he wanted her life insurance sadly she would have had to die before she had a chance to tell anyone, by phone or in person. Sounds awful.

  7. It has just occurred to me : Are we sure it is Allison’s hand writing in that diary?

    There were apparently other women besides TMcH. Did TMcH and Allison find out about more of GBC’s indiscretions that evening?

    TMcH was clearly besotted and obviously under GBC’s spell the same as Allison was, who else was? For TMcH it was exciting and naughty, it was a contest, she was totally infatuated and GBC loved the power of his women wanting him so he made offers they could not refuse. This is not unique to GBC by the way, I have seen ba$*A%ds operate like this before with dire consequences and one of them was his apparent “friend” (term I now use very loosely) so whatever these guys are feeding on its poison to them and everyone around them.

    It appears now that GBC did not care what people thought, whether he got caught, who he hurt or what it cost ………………………. someone else would pay, right? NO GBC, its time for YOU to pay!

      • Hi Witchetad, I get what you’re saying and think anything GBC does or is involved in is open to question for obvious reasons. I would think though, for the CM to release Allison’s writings, they must have had some confirmation that it was hers or they would be open to legal ramifications. What comes to mind is her parents, or her friend Kerry-Ann verifying this. Someone, surely, must have confirmed it was written by Allison prior to the public release?

          • Well that is what I would think also but as someone else said her writing read more like things she feels meet the criteria of the counselor rather than gut but maybe I’m not reading them right.

            • The counsellor would have asked Allison to list things that brought up an emotive response, which is what these lists appear to be. That’s why I don’t call it a diary. It’s not; it is a working journal.

              IMO Allison crosses items off once she has addressed them with gerbil in their 15min sessions. (Not necessarily that they are resolved.)

              re Allison and astrology in this regard – her 3rd house (communication) is in Virgo so making lists is likely to be normal. Her Moon (emotional need) is also Virgo and in the 3rd house therefore it would be natural to release her emotions onto the page.

              We all deal with a situation differently according to our needs. The counsellor may have agreed for Allison to release this way, we don’t know. As to whether the journal should have been released into the media – again we all respond differently.

              There is no huge social/moral dilemma or the media would not have released them – our media is conservative in this country.

              I choose to think that if the journal entries help just one person with a method of emotional release, then Allison would approve.

              • I have no problem with the writings themselves. Writing is therapy. Be it a journal/a diary/a reflection/a whatever…. they are Allison’s words and words I doubt she would ever, ever have envisaged would become fodder for public consumption. Relationships are about intimacy and generally the sorts of things we are reading that have been written by Allison, would never be seen by others.

                To my mind, it is an invasion of privacy but one that has become unavoidable. I know very few people who would be comfortable in the knowledge that such information would be available to the world. If in any way it assists with finding the truth about her death, then fair call that it is available, otherwise, I think it very sad on Allison’s behalf. Even if on the advice of a therapist, such intimacy of one’s life and pains, is not something individuals would be comfortable with sharing. IMO.

                • GBC was the one who released Allison’s notes. As such, I don’t think invasion of privacy was ever an issue, it was a legal defence strategy with the agenda of getting him off the hook.

      • Still working on that book title Witchetad:
        “How to Get Your Money in My Pocket” (without you noticing…)
        The keys to success in business, BC style.

        • From all this analysis maybe he never got the chance to spread his wings and fly and as a consequence he simply didn’t care any more. None of that would permit him to plead insanity for murder though. If you are innocent why the need for all the files and evidence? You wouldn’t need to do anything because it would be obvious that you were not involved. As we know from kids, only the guilty have to have excuses. And I go back to this point over and over again, if he was innocent why isn’t anyone (especially from the family) out there searching for the perpetrator?

        • Dear QCL, you quote:
          “How to Get Your Money in My Pocket” (without you noticing…)
          The keys to success in business, BC style.

          Using NLP “Technology”? lol

      • Sadly it does Witchetad….. a version of “Fatal Attraction” came to my mind early on….although greed may have had a lot more to do with it than attraction……time will tell….

    • Witchetad, you last paragraph has been playing in my mind.
      “It appears now that GBC did not care what people thought, whether he got caught, who he hurt or what it cost …..”
      The same thoughts were playing through my mind through the March Court proceedings.
      It was these same thoughts that prompted my posts regarding the diary journal.
      It’s like he can’t see or think that he might be guilty of anything. Ever.
      It’s also these thoughts that conjure a picture of this “man” hugging his father.
      It’s these images that conjure thoughts of spinelessness, of yellow, of arrogance, of an inflated self image. Of living on another planet.
      What sort of “man” is this?

      • The answer is possibly ‘man’ who is the product of an unhealthy and dysfunctional family. With severe personality disorder/s of his own. Fortunately these do not qualify as a defence on the grounds of insanity, if GBC ever decides to change his plea, which I doubt he would. I agree with you, nothing about GBC’s actions indicates a person having the concept of accountability (affairs, financial dealings, using others for his own gains etc).

        I was chilled on my one day in court, how attentively GBC sat listening to all the witnesses as if he was observing an interesting case being heard – not his own. He had a huge lever-arch file next to him in the accused’s box with masses of neat colour-coded post-it flags down both sides. Something not right there at all.

      • I noted that a few photos exist of him hugging Bwana, with EBC looking on. Did he never hug her, I wonder, or did only the Bwana hugs get published by sheer chance???

        • Not sure RIP now that you mention it, I’ve only seen images in the media of GBC hugging his father. Could be chance as you say. But there is definitely something off about his relationship with his mother.

  8. The “Diary” is also Allison’s personal written testimony. She has explained the situation she was in. She has revealed and exposed her partner and many of his character traits. Defects of character may be more to the point.
    It was not her role to define or diagnose him. But I hope a professional person can and will do just that.
    Like the fingernail scratches, the diary is Allison’s personal testimony. May it be read and understood accordingly.

    • And the oddest thing about the matter is GBC doesn’t appear to have the slightest inkling that the diary or journal is incriminating. Within these pages is written evidence of the abuse with which she was subjected. Gas-lighting comes to mind.

      • Exactly QCL, especially given that it was GBC’s decision to release Allison’s writings! They are a very poignant and telling insight into Allison’s life and marriage and extremely damning of GBC. And yet being focused on himself and his new agenda of ‘getting off’ the charge of murdering Allison, he released them through his legal team thinking they will help paint a picture of a woman on the brink of suicide.

        Talk about twisted thinking… He must be the bane of his legal team’s lives and careers. They are attempting to instruct a narcissist on his defence strategy. I can imagine Danny Boyle’s wry smile when Allison’s writing came to light. I wonder whether the counsellor will be subpoenaed to give evidence at the trial, as her evidence would be extremely telling, and might provide further background support as a motive for murder. Gaslighting, the out of favour wife no longer doing what she is told, and thus having to be dispensed with for GBC to continue on his narcissistic path.

        • Oh yes gaslighting, and there are people out there who actually practice that stuff and think they can get away. They use the cover of NLP to explain it, cockily claim to be pros and ruin peoples lives, then blame their victims. A typical cycle of a psychopathic narcissist. And where does it get them? Hated by many, owing people a fortune and experiencing a complete loss of respect by everyone who once knew them.

        • Unless I am severely mistaken, given his demeanour at the March Court sessions, as well as his demeanour throughout the search followed by his business as usual attitude, this GBC appears completely detached emotionally and spiritually from Reality.
          Reality of any description.
          Another thought here: Supposing that someone else was responsible; This piece of (supposed) humanity is still completely detached or disconnected from the reality that someone has murdered his wife.
          Allison has been coldly callously murdered, and he calls a Lawyer, the Insurance Company, and takes a holiday.
          Then his sister makes he public appeal for money to assist not Allison, but GBC.
          He has a MVA and his thoughts are not for Allison, (still missing), but for himself. He’s “A little bit hurt, but OK now.”
          W…wh…..wha….. what about Allison!!! She could be lying cold and dead somewhere…
          Is this for real or what? This stuff beggars belief!

      • I would think any significant occasions such as birthdays, mothers’ day etc would be bitter sweet…. Poor old Prince Harry had to be reminded by some twat that his mother was dead. Sometimes empathy is non-existent.

  9. Hmm, thought everyone was quiet for Mother’s Day yesterday but it appears I just wasn’t getting emails. Weird.

  10. I posted this earlier today but it’s ended up higher up on the page. Just wanted to say this post of yours MM http://astrologyincrime.com/category/baden-clay/allison-victim/ on gives some further insight into GBC’s relationship with his mother, sister and mistress. It’s interesting to read it again, especially what drives EBC who has slipped into the background and seems to present to the world a different face to who she is behind the scenes in the family.

    I agree so much with what you write about OW, I feel she is looking at some type of breakdown in the future as she must be under a huge amount of stress. And yes, TMH was used but also played a huge catalyst role in Allison’s demise. Very interesting stuff, thanks for all your input MM it’s really invaluable.

    • You’re welcome SfA, just holding my end up best I can.

      Allison was not brought up to deal with these tough, selfish women who don’t even understand the concept of ‘the sisterhood’.

  11. Thank you for the lovely photo at the top of this page. And thank you for putting the diary entries there too. I feel they have a lot to say between the lines.
    First words I see “Afterwards why so mean?”
    I thought he told his Jezabel and probably all the rest, that they had not been “intimate” for years?
    The entry appears quite recent.
    World’s lousiest lover. (There’s another book title for you Witchetad.)
    And his “after the event” sweet words of romance tenderness and caress, aren’t too flash either.
    Laughed at undies, Told her she smelled.
    Bloody hell, what school did he go to?
    Allison has her own written testimony within these pages.

      • Yeah… Hmmm…. makes one wonder about his sexuality? Sure doesn’t look like the words or actions of a real man.

        • Sometimes I have to do country farm type work. Here’s a funny thing I have noticed about cattle.
          Different breeds of cattle have different character attributes.
          And they appear to be blatantly racially prejudiced. (Clearly haven’t read the rule book.)
          For example, if you have a herd of say Brahmans and you add some Herefords, you may expect all hell to break loose. They virtually say, “you lot can stick in your corner.” Or “We are a higher class than you lot.”
          Lots of bashing up and intimidating happens too.
          (They do assimilate after a few months but you will see that they don’t readily want to share treats like the best shade.)
          The different breeds also have different voices.
          The Santas and Brahmans have a proper deep throaty bellow.
          The Angus have an almost high pitched whine that’s supposed to sound like Moo.

          Someone else’s Angus cattle have been squeaking away all afternoon.
          And all I can think of is:
          “I’m a little bit hurt but I’m OK now.” ***Sniff*** Effeminate gestures. Inappropriate glances at pretty udders too good to be true. Effeminate nonetheless.
          PS No offense intended to Angus owners. (I would like them more if they weren’t such fence crawlers.)

          • Dear QCL,

            Yes to everything, lol, and on the analogy, I’ve also found that with our animals, horses, and dogs.
            :D

          • No Mandolin, I suspect it is odd to many – much we do not know. How many of us can ask him for a phone (and get one!) as well as ask him for hundreds of thousands of $$? (less lucky with this it seems)….and offers to sleep at his place??

  12. Pictures… Large portrait….with her!
    40th Birthday…Four weeks later started.

    No Allison, you were not being prudent or unreasonable. You were being normal. He was not just dirty, he was filthy.
    PS The portrait would have been expensive. And altogether dammed unnecessary. Enough to cause an almighty blazing row IMO. There is the additional matter of the pure insult slap bang in Allison’s face.
    INSULTING would be an understatement.
    World’s shittiest “businessman” another title for you Witchetad.
    PPS Just the thought of a husband doing that to a wife makes me see red. A studio photo of his Jezabel……………??? The very thing to get her in the mood…..?

    • I keep wondering if Jezebel was a master at manipulation, causing GBC to take steps that would guarantee upsetting his marriage, in order that Allison would give up on him, and then she could have l to herself.

      I also wonder if GBC’s antics were designed to cause Allison to recognize that the marriage was well and truly over, but it is difficult to know what he expected her do do upon reaching that conclusion. His financial dilemma meant he certainly could not afford a Divorce.

      • There was only one conclusion to the financial issues, it was called Life Insurance. Any other avenue would be begging, stealing, borrowing and all of those would take another decade or more to secure.

        • I agree Witchetad, life insurance appears to have been the primary goal. Getting rid of unwanted wife a ‘bonus’, so he can pursue whomever he wanted thereafter. Not convinced how TM ranked in his view of the future, although I think she believed with Allison gone she had a future with her GM and pursued this goal vehemently.

          Her continued involvement, evidenced by the portrait/s of them together would have been very handy in the end for him to put his final plan into action. So she was likely handy to him attaining his goal too. Who knows how much he got her to assist with that fateful night….

          It seems difficult to know with two people so detached from reality, lacking a moral compass, and each being consumed with their entwined yet at the same time selfish wants and goals, who was actually manipulating/using whom….or did they feed off each other equally???

          I do wonder if he is not going to try and blame her….it may be what OW has been alluding to as being the ‘truth’….I don’t think her ‘innocent GBC’ theory will cut the mustard – he was far too covered in wounds made by someone who fought for her life with whatever means she could…

          …and I’m not altogether sure her presence in Brisbane on 19/20 May and subsequent role in the sage is entirely coincidental….

          …it is amazing how 4 possible accomplices complicate matters, isn’t it?

          • It is bamboozling, RIP. I was prepared to give Livvy the benefit of the doubt until she claimed her brother was innocent. Especially considering her beliefs, this is a big statement for her to make. What does she know, I wonder?

            • You know, I agree with you. I had no feeling that she could be involved until she said that. I don’t care how much love and connection a family member has with another, when it comes to GBC’s behavior and the fact that his wife was murdered and he chose to say stuff that was clearly a pathetic excuse, all that goes out the window.

      • Dan…that’s what I don’t get….why would he try to create a divorce situation….it makes no sense. To try to push her to the edge of suicide, yes, that would make sense. I wonder what the ultimate plan was? Was it to look like suicide, which, if so, he had been looking at this for some time, could he have not planned it better…..or was the plan interrupted? I think there was another plan, but it alll went belly-up that night….which we have concurred previously. That is what makes me believe they won’t get away with it….the plan didn’t go to plan……….there are slip-ups, bungles, the whole thing is a shambles….and they’re not getting away with it.

    • Evil action QCL, perpetrated by an evil man, supported by an evil sister & motivated by his “on the side” screw McHugh.
      He took that portrait to his & Allison’s family home, he KNEW it would wound her (Allison) – vengeful, nasty, deliberate action by a very evil man, keeps on picking away and breaking down Allison’s sense of self, she concentrated on her girls, he concentrated on her demise & disposal, ‘cept, he’s not the brightest spark in the scout’s camp, there was more than one driver, a cold & calculating steadier of the ship who tried to make sure it did not smash againt the rocks.

    • I am sure we cant assume any mothers love but in terms of basis of relationships as MM says its written in the stars at conception. GBC comes across as a very weak person who is trying to be something/one else to please. But it looks fake and it appears to compensate he chooses to have wield his willy tiny power over the weaker sex which is even more pathetic. I disagree with all comments regarding mothers loving girls more than boys, I find that a complete cop out.

  13. Note: Posted above, but all narrowed and hard to read, so re-posted:

    I wonder if assessments for ‘personality disorder’ have been conducted in the main players? Clearly posters are using terms like ‘dysfunctional’ relationships, but what usually drives these is some kind of personality disorder as well. These labels are just ways of categorizing to be able to identify & understand the nature of the beast.

    Despite all the psychiatric/psychological labelling, MURDER is murder. These people acted, with adult capacity and adult free will – to end the life of another person, a mother of three little children, for their own perceived gain.

    Did they ‘conspire’ together? There seems to be a degree of ‘calculation’ before/after the fact IMHO.

    They are accountable under the Law of this land for what they have done.

    • Agreed, ‘cept we don’t know if it was one two or more at this point. Does anyone recall someone else making a call about A’s life insurance policy? If so, who was it?

        • Unfortunately he would have had to get her to make some enquiries herself, these sort of private matters can not be discussed with 3rd parties.

          So either he asked Allison to make the enquiries, supposedly to try and find ways for them to save money or something of the sort. Sadly she had no idea in what mortal danger she was in…..what these enquiries would lead to…..really awful.

          The authenticity of her voice during these phone calls would have to be confirmed, since with so many possible female accomplices, there is of course an outside chance that he got one of them to phone and impersonate Allison. He would have known Allison;s password and answers to any personal questions she may have been asked to verify it was her on the phone, so it is not impossible such calls may have been staged. I tend to think he is shrewd enough to have manipulated trusting Allison to actually make the calls, for whatever reason he put forward.

          I think someone said one of the requests was to link his and her insurance – that right?? If so, does this mean if her $1million insurance could be linked to his $3 million insurance, that if she died he would have got $4 million? Or even half of the $4 million? If so this is significant!!!!!!!!!!

          • That is also what I questioned when the insurance policy discussions came up originally, but I think it never happened or couldn’t happen. What is astounding is that he couldn’t pay the basic phone bill but kept those large insurance policies going much to the delight of the insurance companies while he owed other people who were funding his dream a fortune. What sort of a narcissistic decision is that?

            • Did you read GBC’s turnover? I am not an accountant. He had a lot of companies (which is a warning to start off with). What was the turnover being funnelled into? He was too cheap to book a room, lol.

              I noticed that GBC’s parents’ phone/internet expenses, that the company paid for, were huge, yet they had retired.

              Allison was on full Centrelink payments. I don’t understand how she could have been.

              • Exactly Moonlight 1313 re your comments “Allison was on full Centrelink payments. I don’t understand how she could have been”.When I saw the amount of Centerlink that Allison received, I was stunned! Someone has done some creative acounting. Several members have queried; “WHERE DID ALL THE MONEY GO?”

                • It seems there has been plenty to hide in that family. Now jus what did Allison know that she could threaten to expose?

              • Well I suppose the entire shebang was a cock up so the authorities will no doubt be combing through all of that now. People like this have lots of companies to funnel money through, complicate the forensics so to speak. I’ve seen it done before as I was the victim of it so I know it goes on. These are the type of people who claim they earn nothing, cry poor to friends so they give them everything including down to coffees and meals when they are out (how many did GBC ever pay for I wonder?) but then they crow that they are experts in their field and just copy me and the worlds your oyster! None of their life makes sense and eventually it all unravels just like it has to. I would be watching for overseas trips, where to, with whom, what are they taking, how much are they bringing back, all of that sort of stuff. Through the actions of others I’ve learnt a lot on how to be a first class nonaustralian and it makes me sick to the stomach to see people doing this stuff. There is no way in hell you need to stoop to using other people to take from while crowing about being a somebody and taking all the glory as others fund your pedestal. I am certain that Allison would have been highly embarrassed about the entire thing and she probably made that known. Her own upbringing would have made it perfectly clear when something was not being done ethically. Was that the catalyst for this? Was she doomed the minute she spoke out against anything that was being said or done? Seen that before too.

                • Just thinking, TMcH was probably free sex, free coffee, free meals, free rides, she probably used a lot of her own money to fund business stuff because she believed the Gerbil. I wonder if she is sitting back now thinking what a complete sightless fool was I? I hope that makes her come forward, as hard as it would be for her to confront her stupidity, and say everything she knows including how they operated within the business. I still don;t think she was involved in the murder in any way I think she was a smitten fool who was manipulated for GBC’s temporary use. I do think it is possible she could be framed somehow given what she knows. I guess you only need to look what happened to Allison when she became a thorn or was she the rose between the thorns?

                  • She might have been a ‘thorn’ in their sides; she had a different value system; she may have objected to things. You make a good point there: “look what happened to Allison when she became a thorn…”.

    • Where is that information and how much was it? You could probably work it out if you assume NIL income. They could have been using a trust so she was probably not encourage to get a real job for herself as that would screw up the trust distribution usefulness thing. And then they could have had unit trusts attached to those trusts to create complications for anyone trying to get back what was theirs. All of it will come to light eventually and its possible that TMcH knows a fair bit about how they operated so her information would be pretty precious you would imagine. For sure there would still be some things withheld from everyone on instructions. Whatever was going on I think it could be reasonably assumed that A objected to a lot of it and paid a mighty price.

    • It was alleged in documents released at the committal hearing that Allison had received something like $124,000.00 in Centerlink payments. You would need to check the documents for the accurate amount, but it was something like that.

      • WOW Caro, that is an insane amount of Centrelink payments – it is multiples of what many people who work earn!
        I had missed that! Are we talking over a long time period – surely not one year????
        How in spite of all this help and the million he’d borrowed could he not keep things afloat? It would seem to insinuate that money had been siphoned off big time for something…somewhere…??? Maybe they are using some of it now to pay for his legal eagles…??? Puzzling how they are paid now, considering at his first bail hearing OW begged funds form all & sundry to fund that one hearing.
        Is it not bizarre – absolutely none of the circumstances surrounding this case appear ‘normal’!???

  14. Bringing this up out of order but the last comment by MM on the last post session raises questions too:

    “I wonder if NBC seen sitting at the roundabout was somehow connected with a second car needing to be returned home?”

    Was he there to forewarn someone coming along not to go that way because they would be spotted or recorded? Why there, why then, why?

  15. I think I need to take a break from this blog, too many questions:

    WHY?

    The car placement
    The zoloft packet
    The removal of the vacuum etc.
    The story to the kids about mum being down the hole and not coming back
    The business as usual, school work etc. when MUM is MISSING?
    The need to borrow a phone and more money
    The phone missing
    The phone location in odd position
    The caterpillar scratches
    The shaving scratches
    The plant material from home on the body
    The missing fingernail on the body but caterpillar scratches on the face
    The blood in the car
    The say that he was advised not to go looking for A
    The hiding the affair when it was obvious to everyone
    The accident at the shopping centre
    The moving work premises
    The holiday so soon after
    The free sex when wife is missing
    The loan of the phone when there was plenty of other phones available
    The phone calls at odd hours and places
    The denial of phone calls
    The enquiries about the insurance policies
    The need to get a hold of the insurance asap
    The selling the house at the coast asap
    The bury the body asap
    The using other peoples properties to have sex in
    The lies, cheating, deceiving
    The using people with positions
    The hurry at the drs
    The promise to his jezebel that he would be free by 1 July
    The roping family into the lies
    The clothing A was found in
    The washing done so quickly
    The issues with children at the school
    The lies to the business colleagues
    The huge insurance bills when you can’t even pay the basics
    The pile of docs at the hearing
    The response “Im not guilty your honour”?

    BC, Please explain……………..

    • There is so much emerging that I’m wondering if Allison felt things were ‘so big’ that she would not be able to get out with the children.
      Was she overwhelmed, yet had to keep it to herself as she could not tell anyone the extent of what she suspected?
      Were these creative accounting activities bordering on the illegal?
      Were charges likely if she informed of their activities?
      Did she feel trapped? The old double-bind: make it hard for her to stay and harder if she attempts to leave?
      Maybe she wasn’t allowed to ‘leave’ because of what she knew about their creative accounting?
      IMO the financial picture seems to yeild ‘smoke signals’ and we know that ‘where there is smoke, there is fire!’ Maybe some answers will emerge at the trial.

  16. That was 39 reasons Witchetad plus three more from me.

    The fact he was unable to satisfactorily explain his movements on the night of the 19 April up to the Police arrival early 20 April. This was the precise time during which Allison disappeared.

    The enquiry of local political member Bruce Flegg regarding cameras at THE roundabout.

    The non involvement with Allison’e funeral. He did not carry her coffin. He did not speak words for Allison. He should have been her most significant “other.”

    This following one was yours Witchetad. I am merely elaborating.
    The saying “he was advised not to go looking for A.” However this appears to be a complete fabrication of fact. Apparently NO-ONE ever said that. Unless it was Bruce Overland, in private.

    • Three more ‘smoke signals’:
      1. NBC spotted sitting at the bus stop at the roundabout around 11.30pm that night;
      2. GBC’s enquiry of Mr. Bruce Flegg, MP, about cameras at the roundabout that night;
      3. The QLD Police interest in anything unusual spotted at the roundabout that night.

      • To add to Witchetad’s list: GBC advised lover lady, alias Jezabel, (and person not ruled out as an accomplice)
        “Best to lay low for a while.”
        This nifty piece of “advice” was given when GBC was (unexpectedly) being scrutinized.

  17. I apologise for raising this subject.

    Here is the link, “Forensic Accountant (A), Section 34″ – thank you so much to Mountain Misst’s archives.

    http://astrologyincrime.com/court-docs/

    I’m feeling really uncomfortable due to being protective of Allison, perhaps we should remove this subject?

    The Centrelink payments were $22,795.43 for the 2009/2010 Financial Year. The children may have been 3, 5 and 8 years old then, so perhaps that is correct due to Child Care and Family Tax Benefit; (although still a lot of money, I am surprised) whereas the reporting for Gerbil in the Court Documents is 2010/2011.

    • Snap: I was just preparing to reply myself Moonlight – LOL. :)

      “ Centrelink advised that Allison Baden-Clay received, on 18/7/2011 a payment totalling $22,795.34. This payment was made after a reconciliation of family tax benefit and Child Care Benefit for the financial year 2009/10.”

      So if you multiply that over a few years it soon adds up, folks. There is nothing untoward going on.

    • It is not Allison who is being scrutinized here Moonlight.
      A certain holier than thou, supposedly an “accountant”, supposedly a real estate person, however, IS being scrutinized. The same real estate person who screwed his business partners over well and truly. A “would be if he could be” type person.
      Thanks also for supplying the link.
      Once again it appears that it was Allison who was providing the bread and butter, even if courtesy of Centrelink.

        • Hi Lilli….so so relevant….that’s the very thing i’m struggling with. I can see beyond reasonable doubt in many ways….but how do I justify that? Does there need to be scientific proof? obviously not….. Does there need to be a place of death proven? does there need to be a cause of death? does there need to be being placed at crime scene? where was Allison murdered? All this stuff………Yoshi?

  18. This was copied directly from the link to the QPS Statment of Witness for the analysis of the mobile phones. It is a copy from a pdf file thats why it reads a little strange. However what I noted was that the facetime call attempt was deleted but forensics were able to retrieve it.

    “Within the Timeline part ofPhysical Analyser, it was observed that a ‘FaceTifie’ call was made
    or the 19th April 2012 at 2:30:25, in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC), When converted to
    Brisbane time (GMT +10) this time converts tobe 12:30AM on the 20rb Ap.il 2012 In addition,
    I also observed this ‘Facetime’ call in the Outgoing Call entdes wittrin the Physical Analyser
    software. The phoue nur’:ber obsei^ved for this call was 0400 466 100. This data was observeC as a ‘deleted’ entry.”

    My question is why was this deleted? And wasnt this done when GBC was “sleeping like a baby”?

    I must say attempting to read those documents is laborious and I am by no means an expert on anything but an analytical onlooker. But they must have had several additional fingers to be able to juggle that many phones and sim cards. I struggle with one and I can only answer one at a time so something odd is on when you need that many.

    • The facetime call has been disproven according to the courts – the extracted information was a computer software error. The facetime call was never made; it did not exist in the first place. The technological explanation was a “false positive”.

      • Well thats weird why does it appear in the first place? Gremlins in the software perhaps. I guess one has to accept the experts analysis.

        • I’m with you on that one Witchetad. Why indeed does it appear in the first place?
          One teeny weeny question.
          Has any member of this family done anything at all that resembles tampering with evidence or attempting to remove evidence, or even complying with lawfully requested requirements?

        • Witchetad I too have felt suspicious about this ‘false positive’ from when it was announced. Something about it does not feel right to me…. How can a deleted call show up by accident, and then coincidentally it shows to be made to a very significant number….and then all of a sudden it supposedly never happened???? Huh…???

      • Glad you qualified that MM by saying “according to the courts”.
        Because there have been rather a lot of convenient coincidences in this entire affair. In fact it appears the whole darned show is nothing but convenient coincidences interlaced with “plausible explanations.”

  19. And whilst on the subject of character references or what sort of characters these people are: I am still waiting for one person who has known them either in Rhodesia, or England, or Melbourne or Toowoomba or Brisbane or anywhere else in the world to come forward and say “Yes, I knew them well and they were totally upstanding, hardworking honest and always helping others, etc.”
    I didn’t mean someone from the swingers club either.

    • Something I’ve been waiting on too QCL. (Oh and giggles re: swingers club). The silence is deafening either way. I imagine this clan have exploited & poo’d on many in their time & it surprises me more dirt hasn’t surfaced… yet.

  20. Good luck, doing that would then open those people to scrutiny and what would that uncover?

    More of the same.

    This type don’t like anybody asking questions and they hide like weazils, deny, blame, cheat, lie, steal all in the name of their own version of SUCKCESS!

  21. Sorry in advance folks if this topic has already been covered but I sure would like people’s views on these matters:

    Has the marriage counsellor given a statement?
    Is s/he deliberately trying to duck appearing on the grounds of professional privilege?
    Has the courts made a determination on this matter?
    Can we expect his person to divulge at the trial?
    I’m thinking this person can shed considerable light on the state of play at the time as well as the emotional state of both parties. Is the prosecutor holding this person back for the trial?
    Is this person the ace in the pack?

    • It is my understanding that the Marriage Counselor avoided giving testimony at the Committal Hearing citing Professional Privaledge, and the court was to rule on that at a future point.

      It is my guess that the Counselors Concern would be that people using her services expect to be able to confide in her with absolute confidence that anything they advise the Counselor of will not be revealed to the world.

      In the event that information that the Counselor is critical to the trial outcome, than the Counselor may e prepared to provide such information :”In Camera”, i.e, is revealed in a closed court and under orders that it be suppressed by all concerned.

      I do agree that the information known by the Counselor would be pivotal in this case.

      • I would have to say the law is an ass sometimes and it was reinforced yesterday for me in hearing of a rape case where all charges were dropped. The truth will never be known and I suspect the victim would be doubly traumatized….firstly by the rape itself, and then the agony of going through the court procedures….make that triplely traumatized… to see no charges laid. To my mind after being abused from many angles, it would be difficult to pick yourself up from the Victorian dust to push further. It was a complex case with many variants.

        Back to Allison’s murder, it would be interesting if in fact the counsellor took the stand. If the main suspects aren’t speaking, then one would have to question why under oath, anybody would have to speak. Or am I misunderstanding the fact that the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth will be revealed.

        Of course, depending upon who the counsellor is, and whose privacy and confidentiality they feel they are protecting. Everything else possible that has been seen as appropriate for public consumption at this stage and shown, has not come from the camp that isn’t speaking.

        • The fact that the family are not speaking might mean that they actually have nothing to offer. We are assuming here that none of them had anything whatsoever to do with this crime… and at this point I have just discovered I have turrets but don’t fear for me as I recover rather quickly. I imagine they would be madly trying to refute all the accusations thrown at them publicly and privately. Its pretty clear that they are not in a very good position with respect to this case. And IF they didn’t have anything to do with GBCs shenanigans on the night of the 19th then they would be pretty shaken from what’s come to light. Just throwing it out there.

          • The marriage counsellor would also be in a difficult position but perhaps they have the golden egg after all.

            Justice may be blind, but she has very sophisticated listening devices. ~Edgar Argo

          • What can one say?? Very entertaining Witchetad!!

            With reference to your words ‘The fact that the family are not speaking might mean that they actually have nothing to offer. We are assuming here that none of them had anything whatsoever to do with this crime…’.

            Irrespective of whether they have committed a crime or not, in the eyes of the law, and their maker, they sinned badly by their lack of empathy, expression of sympathy, and decision to help in no way whatsoever in firstly looking for a member of their ‘family’, and then in helping the police with their enquiries……..

            You have tickled my fancy with your post. Of course, like all writers, I like to have an open mind, and one must take into account, individual weaknesses, fears, lack of social skills, etc which might explain an innocent extended family, if that be the case.

            God bless ya cotton sox and ‘turrets’ is not the worst condition to suffer from, and besides, I won’t worry about your recovery, because as you mentioned, you are a speedy healer, so to speak. Do you mean, inside and out?

          • Witchetad, even on the outside chance that they had nothing to do with GBC’s shenanigans on the night of 19 April 2012, they were there mightly early on the 20th (not normal when someone is merely back late from an ‘innocent’ walk???!!!), mollycoddling him and assisting him in the police interview, whisking the kids away asap before they could be spoken to and generally with what looks like lying and cover-up – NBC even trying to remove a vacuum cleaner and hose likely used during the night’s clean-up from the property. Both NBC and GBC phoned the lawyer and took a ride down south that same afternoon, and NBC barely left GBCs side for the first few weeks, as if he did not trust what GBC may be asked or might let slip. OW’s quick eye-darting, lip-biting co-media interview also spoke volumes.

            There is no way that his parents/sister would not immediately upon seeing him on 20/4 have known that they will never see Allison again and where their son/brother got the many wounds from that he sported that morning.I doubt he would even have tried to lie to them, it would have been futile.

            IMO at the very least they appear to be accessories after the fact. Although I will not be surprised if they were in on the plan and each played specific roles in the execution. All just did not feel right here right from the start – behaviours seemed very ‘abnormal’.

            • Sorry to hear about your diagnosis, Witchetad. But it’s good to hear of your positive attitude to it. Wishing you all the best. Life is what we make it, isn’t it?

              • Yes from me too Witchetad. I do not know much about Tourettes, I think I read most people get it very mildly and that there are many ways to control symptoms successfully. Wishing you the very best!

            • Well said! Agreed RIP Allison.
              Witchetad, sometimes challenges like this come our way. It is amazing how we can learn to live with and not let them defeat us. Keep positin’ with us. Cheers

      • For those interested in the counsellor and their presence or not in the court, we are not dealing with an individual counsellor acting on their own. My analysis of the phone records, indicates that the organisation Relationships Australia was Allison’s choice – see http://www.raq.org.au

        It would be the entire organisation which would be ‘on the line’ if the relationship details between GBC and Allison were to be divulged to the public. IMO the closed court would be the ‘goer’, just as Dan says.

        • The professionally qualified marriage counsellor, from RAQ, practices under the auspices of that organisation, but is professionally liable for her own practice under the Act/professional ethics/employment contracts governing that area of professional practice. RAQ is government funded.
          My understanding is that in marriage/relationship counselling – ‘professional privilege’ is contained in the Act which governs that area of service/practice; the purpose is to prevent partners from using content raised in counselling against each other in Family Court divorce/separation/custody settlements or arrangements. The counselling content is privileged to allow open & honest negotiations. Ususally the Counsellor is immune from givein evidence in Court. However,this immunity called ‘professional privilege’ is ascribed by the Law, and can be revoked by the Law under certain circumstances. In my opinion, this privilege should be revoked in the case where one partner is suspected of murdering the other partner.

            • I agree with you Caro, murder is entirely different from use in a Family Law court. It’s my understanding that the marriage guidance counsellor was listed to give evidence at the committal hearing, but declined on the day (I wonder why that didn’t happen before the court date?) My guess is that as GBC and Allison were clients/patients of the service, both parties would have to agree to the counsellor giving evidence in court. Clearly Allison was not in a position to give consent, and it seems clear that GBC denied the counsellor the right to waive professional privilege for obvious reasons.

              I agree that his/her evidence would be extremely telling, and at the committal the magistrate didn’t rule on this as there was sufficient evidence without his/her testimony to commit GBC to trial. I suppose this will come up again, and it will be interesting to see whether a judge subpoenas him/her to give evidence at the trial. Client privilege seems to be fairly stringent, but then you have to question why in a similar vein doctors are allowed to give evidence in court. This seems a little contradictory to me.

              • Exactly, a Supreme Criminal Court hearing a case of MURDER of one marriage partner allegedly by the other – is a different context to Family Court matters pertaining to divorce, separation, custody arrangements & property settlements etc.Given the circumstances, IMO professional privilege should be revoked in that specific case as the Counsellor’s evidence may assist with the murder case.

                • I have pondered the counsellor appearing and giving some kind of evidence for some time now and feel I don’t think it will add much more damning evidence that is not already available through Allison’s journal of their counselling sessions. Personally I don’t think it will matter if they do or don’t….just MO.

  22. Interesting thread and great commentary. thanks for the input. Since I started it, can I now change the tact and ask this.

    Leaving our legal rules aside, what should the counsellor be compelled to do?

    As a professional person, I’ll make this statement. In situations of partnerships, you are engaged to support one of the partners to a greater extent than 50%. I suggest therefore that our counsellor in question “felt” s/he had a greater fealty towards Alison than hyphen-man on the basis of input alone. Alison clearly was the instigator of the councelling engagement and contributed heavily. Hyphen-man was like a petulant kid and simply pushed the peas around the plate…missed a few sessions, not into the jive at all! No wonder, his “swimmers” were keen for a dive into the TMcH pool!

    I think we should have a “Judges Call” whereby the Judge can call whoever an ask questions in the hope of extracting the truth.

    • Enjoyed your analogy of “a petulant kid who pushed his peas around the plate”
      He didn’t like the peas, wasn’t gonna be told to eat them – even if they were good for him. Absolutely agreed. Gerbil may have been a poor counsellng candiate as his MO was to obfuscate, not reveal & seek to heal.
      Hypothetically, the Snr’s appeared to be overly involved in Gerbil’s adult personal & business life, would most likely have discouraged counselling as some of their ‘stuff’ may have entered the picture. Potentially, the counselling may have threatened their ‘grip’ on their son. It is possible that Allison’s engagement with RAQ was seen as a disgrace, a ‘blot on the BC name’ from their perspective.
      All hypothetical at this point. We’ll possibly learn more at Trial.

    • God blesseth your cotton sox and underoos alsoeth! Moats, turrets, stuff, nonsense, imagination and mischief….the plot does thicken so, on this cryptic ‘amateur’ detective site. Oh to have access to the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help me God, or, well, anyone else who is honest and possesses great integrity, empathy and humility.

      Funny thing how these conversations draw out the individual dynamics of posters. The traits I most admire are, and were possessed by, (one now deceased), two of the most moral and principled men I know and both are/were Freemasons. Neither would be party to any illegal activity and as honest as the day is long.

      Also, I think with all due respect to Mr Dickie, who I believe also falls into the category described above of salt of the earth, honest and hard working men, I feel in lumping all Freemason’s in the dodgy category, we include him, which, again, due to this tragedy, and the morals and integrity of the prime suspect, he in effect, has sullied many waters.
      If that makes sense.

      I was thinking yesterday, that with time, for those not personally (ie intimates, family, significant others) impacted upon by the sudden demise of a beautiful human being, Allison Dickie, it is easy to move on. With absense of court and legal business taking place in the public domain (no doubt there is furious work taking place but we aren’t consuming it), it is kind of on the back-burner and for the rest of the world, it is business as usual, pardon the pun.

      While posters occasionally throw up issues which might help keep the home-fires burning here, is it possible to somehow keep the social/emotional spirit alive for the Dickies, the extended family and her friends. I am not articulating this very well, but to understand that which will be the long-lasting impact of a death, a violent death, on a loved one.

      I am not wishing to dwell on the negatives, but in some way, wanting to continue to have empathy for what families in this situation endure for the rest of their natural lives. Kind of like an invisible support network and one that will send them love, prayers and strength after the legal wheels have ceased their business and moved on to another tragic situation to play their ‘game’ and the press stops following it, except for anniversaries and to draw reference to the case when other such tragedies occur. Which no doubt they will, unless breeding becomes more pure and evil no longer exists.

      • Yes Little Fish, as we attempt to lighten the load lets not lighten it so much that we lose sight of the affect our support has on those that matter now. The Dickies must surely be overwhelmed at times with grief and confusion. To think that their son in law could be in a position of being accused of the murder of their daughter is horrifying. They must spend long hours, days even weeks questioning everything that was said and done around him to try to understand just why it got to this.

        • Given their financial situation, Gerard’s relationship with Toni, etc etc and that their return from international travel and living was more than 10 years ago, it was interesting to note that the defendant has a current passport, according to documentation made available. I think it would be interesting to know when that was valid until, and whether the children also held current passports.

  23. RIP Allison “even on the outside chance that they had nothing to do with GBC’s shenanigans on the night of 19 April 2012, they were there mightly early on the 20th (not normal when someone is merely back late from an ‘innocent’ walk???!!!), …”

    What was the earliest documented time they made communications on the 20th? That is aside from the “face facts” time when GBC was sleeping like a baby.

    With respect to my thinking my had turrets its a bit like the old saying a Drs worst nightmare is a woman with a medical journal. Today it could be jumping frenchman disorder. Will get to the bottom of it one day.

    • Witchetad, looking at his phone records for 20/4 GBC made only one phone call to a family member that morning – to his mother at 6:46am, lasting 2 1/2 minutes. Yet when he called QPS at 7:15 his father was supposedly already there to look after the children. Why would NBC have to look after the children if GBC himself had little interest in looking for Allison? Create the impression that he did?

      When they arrived at 8am, OW was already there also and were herding the kids off to school, even though school was just around the corner and presumably would not have started till 9am. Not sure what they would have done at school an hour early, especially after having been told their mother had fallen down a hole and won’t be back…Must have been a very difficult day for school support staff….

      Also interestingly, GBC was seemingly very close to his dad and NBC was the one supposedly summonsed to look after the children. Yet he did not call NBC’s phone number, he called EBC. Could it be because NBC was already there – had been for many hours, perhaps with OW…was the call perhaps to create the impression he only contacted his family then, but in reality NBC and OW could have been with him for many hours already and it was only to fill EBC in on the latest progress…??? Only they will know the truth. But hopefully the truth in all its ugliness will be exposed during the trial and expose all those involved in whatever capacities they were involved in it.

      • Something about the timing of the phone calls I find very suspicious indeed. It is mentioned that GBC didn’t go looking for Allison which in itself sets off the loudest of alarm bells because if he really was concerned he would have been out looking that morning for quite some time before calling the police and roped the family in to do the same. They would have been looking and calling also but no calls from the BC family on A’s line was there? Given the markings on his face was he instructed to call the police because it was pretty obvious that something went down that night? Did the family make a pact to stick by him thru thick and thin? Did they buy his bullshit stories also? Did daddyo say righty ho son I see what you’ve done but i’ll stick by you but you must do as I say? I think GBC panicked and called the police much earlier than intended that morning thereby not giving himself enough time to take care of things. I think it possibly all came unstuck right then and thanks to the keen eye of the law, they spotted some broad faced anomalies immediately.

  24. Too-wit-too-woo
    Fortunately our resident astrologist illuminates, elucidates and reads the darkness.
    (Couldn’t resist that MM, and it’s all a bit quiet.) Just wanted to sing a bit…. “Too-whit-too-whoo…”

        • T wit T woo I’m listening carefully to you, said the wise old owl. Nuff of this silly stuff. When is the first time the BC crew made contact with GBC on 20th. It was apparently pretty early.

  25. Wooooow……I have not been about to post anything lately and catching up on alll the readings has been really overwhelming. Overwhelming in the sense that we are trying sooooo hard to make sense of this bloody shambles. And as well as make sense……try to find the holes in this BC family … there are plenty of holes if the law can ‘see’ it that way. The law always likes to analyse everything and throw in benefit of the doubt (not that I’m an expert by no means)….but it still all has to be beyond reasonable doubt………..that’s what I’m struggling with….even though there is soooo much circumstantial evidence. I feel strongly though, there is much much more to come that will be damning…..
    You know guys, I have just read this whole page and I still feel we are missing something….what the bloody hell is it???? I haven’t had a lot of time to go over alll that we are aware of again, apart from reading this page…..but I’m going to put a few hours aside again this week-end to go over some stuff….
    MM thank you soooo much for putting time into following up that internet login on the morning of 20/4………. wonder what will still come of that? please excuse my ignorance, I’m not really up to speed with iphone and computer technology and not sure what you mean by………. “instant messaging messages – that would appeal to their ‘secretive messages’ routine”…… sorry, I don’t know where that fits with the internet stuff at those times with Allison’s phone and Snr’s computer? We’ll wait and see what Apple come up with….. And thanks again for all your efforts :)
    You guys rock ……seriously…..dedication knows no boundaries when it comes to seeking justice for Allison here…..
    Although I don’t come up with much in the sleuthing area….and just woffle and partake somewhat…….I care, we care, and you guys are very clever in sleuthing….love your work!

    • I intend writing further about the phone conversations Millie, so hang in – it’s a long haul to the trial. I could explain here, however I don’t want to pre-empt any surprises.

      For those who asked me to look into Novy Chardon case, I now have the info I needed so am on it, as we speak. QPS Coomera just might get a nudge… ;)

        • MM thats another very odd case. I eagerly await your further analysis on the phone conversations. Were they able to traceback A’s phone messages to a point without finding her phone?

          • Am not sure what you mean Wichetad by – ‘Were they able to traceback A’s phone messages to a point without finding her phone?’

            You might need to ask Danny Boyle that question.

            • What I meant was do they have the ability to trace a call back to its originating source as a way of finding a phone?

              • AFAIK – Once the battery is flat a phone doesn’t receive any calls. It would then follow that the only opportunity QPS had to track the phone by electronic means, was the thirteen hours on 20th April (until the battery went flat).
                With communication it’s like a loop – the message doesn’t get beyond the first tower if there isn’t a recipient.

                If there is no-one in the forest to hear the tree fall, did it make a noise?

              • Depends on the phone and what you’re doing to trace it I would imagine, Witchetad. You use the word ‘call’. Are you referring to a specific call?

                Allison had an iPhone. We know it had the ‘find my phone’ app operating/turned on (see QPS statements). We also know that GBC didn’t attempt to access it on the morning of the 20th when he said he did (in his IM to her).

                However the phone needs to have a power source to respond. That’s the bottom line and the power ran out early evening 20th April…. Either that or it was destroyed.

                • I guess its only possible if location services are on. If someone calls from an anonymous number for instance, if location services are on, are they able to trace a call back to the location where it came from. This is very complex given the amount of calls roaming back and forwards thru the ether at any one time might make it nigh on impossible. You would have to ask has technology progressed to the point where anyone with the knowledge and equipment could trace the location of a device even if the person making the call or sending the text wanted to remain anonymous for instance. Not sure I’ve made myself very clear with this but if A was not using her phone I find it odd that her phone would turn off so quickly. I believe someone turned it off deliberately and disposed of it, just my theory. I should imagine if she insisted that GBC have his location services switched on then she’d be happy to have hers on because there was no reason why she wouldn’t. I doubt she would deliberately turn that off even if she went for a walk at 10 o’clock at night. You would think she would absolutely want it on then. There is something clearly not right about the phone situation.

          • Thanks hon. Life is a mystery where time takes us.

            If you’d told me I’d be here doing this a few years back I’d go – no way – you’ve got to be kidding – risk my academic reputation – never. Amazing what anonymity does.

            It’s all Allison’s doing, you know… ;) LOL

  26. It is simply astounding to think that software, such that is relied upon without thought, could be seen to be defective, when its reliability is called upon… One minute it is truth (ie FaceTime call is a clincher), and then boom boom, next thing, up in a puff of smoke).

    Witchedhad (sorry if that is misspelt), again, when I refer to the family not-a-talking, and the fact that you suggested they may not have anything to talk about (ie involvement), I refer to Gerard as the family also, because they are all so inexcusably (that was meant to read inexplicably), inter-tangled in their combined lack of empathy and compassion, together with being tongue-tied and therefore inability to speak to tell there version of their evening…..even if prior to the deed being carried out ie murder.

    • Well they sure aren’t the first family to suffer the affliction of total silence. I just think it is completely wrong the they are even allowed to remain silent. I certainly hope that their every movement is being watched because my gut tells me it will be extremely critical in this case. If GBC is guilty (and I think he is but I’m just a foolish member of the public who actually cares) then he could not have carried out the entire shebang by himself. I don’t think it would have been physically possible without being spotted somewhere doing something either the night of or the days thereafter. I feel there is something very big to come out yet which is likely the missing piece to our puzzle. I believe MM has alluded to the fact that there could be another person involved. We don’t know yet whether it was family or a would be family member. I do not think the would be family member was on the inner circle enough yet to be involved in this. I think that was just a infatuated wish but I don’t think it was ever going to be. There would be more eligible pretty things who would qualify much better once the coast was clear. Just my thoughts.

      • Of course I won’t dwell on it, nor lose any sleep as a result, but given that I am blonde, you do so confuse me Witchetad. As do a couple of other posters… Possibly due to the higher order thinking and executive function, mystery, hypotheses, mingling of fact, fantasy and mystical intentions and expressions.

        Perhaps when the time comes for the truth to unfold, we should all be called upon to state our theorizing and help out the professionals:-)))))).

        • Hi Witchetad, I think your thought processes are on the spot and perfectly coherent. The puzzle is just that for us, and we have no other option but to analyse the facts that we have at our disposal, and remain patient for the trial and the facts and evidence that come to light then. Like you, I think we have only seen the tip of the iceberg and there is way more to come.

          • Further reinforcement of my incapacity to keep up with the coherent missives of posters. I was questioning my own capacity and not that of my learned, fellow posters.

            It was about my inability to stay on task, and on track, at posts which questioned or defended involvement of the ‘family’ in a murder, to which it seems there are many unanswered questions and apparently only circumstantial evidence.

            Is it bizarre that one must rely upon processes beyond one’s control, to find answers or justice. Nothing brings back the life of a lost loved one but maybe seeing civilized justice, which necessarily involves much money, time and the legal system as it exists, bringing a little comfort, is some compensation.

            Bad things do happen to good people, sadly, and if all else fails, I guess one can only hope that Karma does its job.

  27. We all know that in the past NBC spruiked on how wonderful he was, manipulating the facts, i.e. he kills animals, and calls himself a “Conversationalist” (how offensive by the way) etc.

    Does anyone know of anyone who in NBC”s place and his generation who would NOT step up, due to pride and plain decency, as Patriarch of the family, and not speak for the family?

    Someone who would have, perhaps the son-in-law’s “Flock” come and look for Allison, too? To pull out every single stop for those children, to talk and ask for help, as a family (as they go away on holidays as a family, as we know, while Allison was still missing).

    Having his daughter leave her children, drive down to Brisbane as she did, when the media were involved, from the beginning to talk for him.

    Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm I think he thought: “Let us go into “Battle Mode” and have the best person speak for us (due to OW background at the Defence Force), let her act and cry and sniffle, that will do it, let her say, “Allison was depressed”.”

    Imagine, any of us, someone in our family is missing, “Dad, can you come over and help me clean the car at 7.30am, this is so important. What? Look for my wife? No, I need to clean the car, while she is stuck down a hole.”

    Ridiculous.

    Thank goodness for that smart policeman who called GBC in as suspicious, I commend you.

      • Yes, a police officer with the smarts, Constable Kieron Ash, and a very upstanding bloke too. Like you Moonlight, I have always puzzled and pondered over OW being the spokesperson for the family. It just does not sit right, while the senior members NBC and EBC retain their silence. OW, alone, has been at every court hearing to date. Pardon the pun, but with the charges her brother is faced with, it is a large cross to bear alone while the rest of the family remain in the background saying nothing. I always think of lamb to the slaughter with OW, no matter what went down and who in the family was involved before or after the fact, she appears to me the scapegoat. This is why I believe she is headed for a major breakdown before or during the trial. I have to question who she is protecting, and who is protecting her.

        • Scrub my last post… One document talks of flight risk which I presumed meant a passport was held, current and in order. Have just seen another legal document (from his lawyers) stating that if granted bail, he wouldn’t apply for a passport. The contradictions are all so confusing.

          I think I give up on this sleuthing business and leave it, hopefully in the capable hands of those entrusted to see justice carried out.

          I wish I had special powers to ease the burden for Allison’s family but I don’t. I send them warm wishes, strength and my sympathy.

          For all my fellow posters with courage, power, imagination and knowledge I hope you feel somewhat more optimistic than I presently.

          • Hi Little Fish, You forgot a teeny weeny little “other element”
            That was the BC easy ability to turn on the lies as and when necessary.
            Would he apply for a passport? “Certainly not!”
            Er….. would that answer be with or without the lies?

            • Evening QCL. Just re-read the document that stated he possessed a passport (QPS). Thought earlier when reading contradictory stuff that maybe I had lost my marbles so was glad to find I hadn’t.

              At times I read stuff and think it is an open and shut case but then am reminded it is all circumstantial and then think of the merry chase required in order to try to find the truth and for a killer, a murderer, a brutal human being to face the music.

                • Hey Little Fish…I think many of us are on that page…..not sure if you saw this …so I’ll copy it here…know you won’t mind lilli :) lilli on May 15, 2013 at 4:08 pm said:
                  Hi all! Thought this article was very relevant and as I am dong catch up reading on here sorry if it has already been seen or posted. It’s about “reasonable doubt” in Qld courts.

                  http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/supreme-court-justice-paul-de-jersey-says-most-people-dont-understand-how-justice-system-works/story-e6frg6n6-1226640642039

                  soooo…how do we define beyond reasonable doubt? ……… Yoshi?

                  • Hi there Millie.

                    Thank you for reposting as I did miss the original.

                    *****They often ask what is beyond reasonable doubt, which I can’t tell them. We can say reasonable doubt is what you believe a reasonable doubt to be,” Justice de Jersey said.******

                    So archaic, and this is the type of system we pin out hopes on!! Sadly, to my mind, the legal game of cat and mouse, ego against ego, hip pocket against hip pocket, makes me realise that when it comes to life and death, it is important to try to do your grieving, healing and resolving of emotional issues, separate to that process.

                    Different horses for different courses. I have been readiing up on some court cases involving high profile footballers of late, and therein lies another totally different angle on the law also…. Sex, power, sport, money, mob mentality and protection.

                    My blood pressure does rise somewhat at the accepted measures in place by which we all must heed. I often find it interesting that as a whole, or as a society, we shake out heads or continue to accept that which is in place as acceptable, when, in fact, it shouldn’t be.

                    Like sheep, we continue to follow blindly, with an occasional buck or leap, or stray but given the flow of motion, resistance is futile. Perhaps for the ordinary person, it would be financially crippling and impossible to fight alone for change, for those moving into different professions, the given protocol is so well accepted and established that questioning is useless and for those operating in a system that cannot be explained would stand upon shaky ground financially and professionally to stand up and be counted in order to fix the wrongs that should be fixed but won’t be fixed.

                    Yeah righto, I know! I am just a Little Fish, ignorant of legal knowledge and the sophistication of the system and complexities, however as a half decent human being who believes in fairness and people should face the consequences of their actions, it is disappointing.

                    I had a sibling killed by a drink-driver whose punishment was a 3 month suspension of his license. That is just a little issue but one that constructs a view on the value of life, and in the bigger scheme of things no doubt the scales of justice don’t always favour the victim, or should I say, fails the victim.

                    So, is there enough room and latitude for extremely clever people, who perhaps choose particular careers because unbeknown to themselves, their tank of empathy runs short, and therefore allows them to view their ‘work’ like a game of chess and approach or view individuals involved, deceased or living, with the compassion they might, for chess pieces.

                • Anyone capable of murder is capable of offering up broad faced lies. I think that would be accounted for in the jury’s verdict or at least one would hope it is.

        • She is an adult. She is making a choice [Sad for Allison on May 18, 2013 at 4:18 pm] – what are they gunna do if she goes home? Kill her? Heavens above! Who’d thunk?!

  28. Born in the UK allows one to apply for both a British and an Aus passport. Now if I were a slippery eel who wore a mustard jacket and had a smarts legal team, I would be quick to say I wouldn’t apply for a passport – meaning an Aussie travel document.

    Meanwhile I send off an application to the UK… I wasn’t lying now was I? ;)

    • With reference to your post along with that of QCL, I am not naive enough to believe people don’t lie, and in this case, that GBC was playing the coy boy, ‘I promise I won’t do that’.

      When I read that he had a passport, my interest tweaked, as I wondered when it had been applied for etc. One would hope the authorities would be all over it, given that he is deemed at risk of flight. That was also at the forefront of my mind with respect to the children and whether they too have current passports etc.

      When placed in safe houses, I wondered whether there was a risk of violence or flight, that was being avoided for the children.

      It just does my head in thinking about whether Allison’s death was pre-planned or a brain snap and if it was the former, then indeed, I feel it is most scary. Of course, it is all horribly tragic, sad, scary, unbelievable etc but if (having trouble with my words here, but sure others won’t find it difficult to fill in the gaps) if in fact, events unfolded in advance to ensure she was to be killed for money, then … well, what can I say as a regular Joe Blow, not used to seeing or dealing with these types of things, that it is bloody horribly awful to think that people with the capacity to plan and ‘execute’ such a strategy, live amongst us, achieve positions of power, rub shoulders with the rich, famous or powerful, and all the while living a lie…. Evil living in a human body.

  29. Oh dear Lord, this gets messier. So MM in terms of their dual citizenship are you saying that any one of them could apply for a UK passport now and be able to travel freely on it? If it was for GBC surely under the circumstances of him being incarcerated in Australia it would make alarm bells ring in the UK and they would be reluctant to grant? A move like that would also seriously uproot the entire family wouldn’t it and I’m not sure any of them are that keen to tear themselves away from one another as that could make corroborating stuff a little difficult. In terms of doing that to escape the financial woes I think they scope of the trust deeds (assuming that is how they might be operating) would allow them to wipe GBC’s debt and start over tomorrow like as if nothing happened and probably even better off and the money would have been diverted post haste. In terms of escaping the law for being accessories or whatever might be a charge then surely our borders are on red alert also. I don’t get the benefit in applying for a UK passport now. That is of course unless they have diverted funds overseas and need to go and bring a bit of cash home, now that wouldn’t surprise me. As i’ve said before if they travel, then there is a very good reason so know where, when, why and what for both on the way out and the the way in.

    • Apologies for confusion Wichetad – apart from his mother, GBC is the only other member of the B-C family, born in the UK.
      My comment about passport applications only applies to the first bail hearing where his lawyer stated that GBC would not be applying for a passport… in reply to the challenge that he was a flight risk – not his current circumstances today.
      My comment was actually following on from QCL’s “May 18, 2013 at 11:56 pm when she said:
      And a liar. A proven liar, but a “catch me if you can” liar.”
      I trust that clarifies the matter.

  30. With regards to the pre planning or “brain snap”
    He promised the mistress (well, one of them), he would be “free” by 1st July. Please explain…
    He organised her that her Will was all in his favour.
    He checked with Suncorp before and after the event about the Insurance payout.
    The Diary entries are suggestive of subliminal manipulation. Or mind control.
    It is my opinion, that he was trying to drive her to suicide.
    (Seems in my opinion, the brain was permanently snapped, twisted or rotten.)

    • I agree with you QCL, he needed to drive her to distraction but he beat her to it because he was the one who snapped that night and A was forced to fight for her life. Unfortunately it appears she was just not strong enough physically. It just shows if there is evil intent in the heart it will eventually make its way out to manifest itself in some way. He chose a path of no return and possibly there are others in on this who will also have to pay. I await the naming of the other/s because I just feel he could not do that on his own he seems too much of a coward.

  31. Coward / bully – same thing, it a very small next step to being a killer, help / no help – only they know.
    What we know is that Allison is dead & that death was not of her choosing.

    • Exactly. Another (others?) decided that she was not wanted, that she had no value, but she had some benefit & monetary value if she were dead, so killed her. Psychopathic? Sure looks like it. Requires punishment by full force of The Law? You bet! The killer didn’t stop to think about the three little girls or Allison’s parents, siblings, friends, work colleagues and local community members.
      Go Danny Boyle. Bring justice to this horrific crime against family and society.

  32. Allison Sandy @ Couriermail states tht GBC, NBC, EBC & OW were in Court yesterday. She states that she is not able to discuss the reason for legal reasons at this stage, but more information should be available by this weekend’s news.See allisonsandy’s tweets for today.

    • alisonsandy: ********Gerard Baden-Clay was back in court today. He was not happy with the proceedings*********
      Zanda: tell us more ?
      alisonsandy: for legal reasons I can’t but I can comment on his appearance. He’s gained a fair bit of weight. He wore a black suit, grey and white tie and sported an very short haircut.
      Gerry: l Hope the caterpillars haven’t been bothering Gerard Baden-Clay too much on the inside!
      Zanda: beard ?
      alisonsandy: Doesn’t look like it – he was clean shaven
      Zanda: will we see a report tomorrow?
      alisonsandy: no – I was hoping there might be something disclosed that was reportable but no.
      alisonsandy: There may be something later in the week separate from this though. Will keep you posted.
      Sean: a horse ran at Eagle Farm on the weekend, called Baden Clay, but it was scratched.
      Alison Alison: So no golden jacket? Did any family members attend?
      alisonsandy: His father Nigel, mother Elaine, sister Olivia.

      Me: Not happy with the proceedings eh? lol. Bet it is to do with the kids. What’s the bet OW wants to have custody of the kids (with GBC’s approval).

        • I don’t know Dan….. (she says innocently)…. but I do know you are not alone!
          By the way, very good article you posted above. Thanks for sharing. It is well worth the read. Sounds awfully familiar.

        • hee hee, I am extremely pleased that he is not happy ;) I can only feel that a personal court appearance by him has something to do with the kids. And if OW made a special trip south again then I imagine she is trying to get the kids. Sounds like someone in the courtroom yesterday had their wits about them. Poor Dickies having to be put through even more agony if this is what the court appearance was about.

          • agree Oz about OW trying to get the kids…seems the courts aren’t bowing to the B-C demands he,he,he…..

      • I really love the bit from Sean: a horse ran at Eagle Farm on the weekend, called Baden Clay, but it was scratched…LOL

    • Wow Caro! Thanks for this.
      How does one access her comments?
      While I appreciate that perhaps she can’t report the content, surely this news is worthy of even one paragraph in The Courier Mail as a simple matter of fact?
      Very newsworthy indeed if the entire Hyphenated family gathered before a court of law.
      Perhaps it was, and I have just missed it.

      • Nice to have an answer to MM’s question above as it might explain a little rather than having us assuming its about the kids. I’m hoping its the other house issue or something that will remove a bit more funding.

        • I can’t envisage there being any need for NBC, EBC, and OW to be in court if the matter related to the House he sold while incarcerated as none of them had anything to do with the property, Custody of the Girls does sound more likely. I wonder if such is the case, do the Girls themselves get a say.

          • Something to do with the girls would be the likely reason considering the court appearance was kept out of the news. GBC wouldn’t have been in attendance in the flesh either for anything else.

            • I agree Dan, you would have to wonder whether the girls are given a say about where and with whom they live. The younger two are probably too young, but I would imagine the elder daughter may be consulted. She must be close to 12 years old I would think. I so hope for these 3 girls, who have been through so much in the past year and have big hurdles to face later on in life, that they are not removed from their school, friends and loving grand-parents into OW’s custody. That would be just too unfair.

              • Twice refused bail…now the Courts not going their way….makes one think how much evidence the Courts have on him that we haven’t heard about….I sure hope so…

        • they’ve removed a bit more funding by appearing in Court Witchetad :) :) :)

          there’s nothing wrong with assuming, that’s what we all do here…..I assume that GBC is guilty as sin…

          • LOL yes well i do too but covering all aspects to be sure and not appear that I absolutely believe he is rotten to the core along with a very close family member.

          • I see this forum as a chance to ‘have a chat, a discussion’ with a group of like-minded people. Facts, theories and assumptions flying left, right and centre. That’s what we do!!

  33. alisonsandy ‏@alisonsandy 21 May
    Gerard Baden-Clay was back in court today. He was not happy with the proceedings @couriermail

    • Do hope there are no changes for the children as the Dickies seem the only stability they have left. I see from the tweets that GBC has grown a little in size but has he grown his moral conscience? Me thinks not because he is still chucking tanties.

    • Hypothetically, likely to be a Family Court hearing based on the same supression of info around a previous hearing for custody of the children – following which the BC Snr’s allegedly gained some access to the children.

      • Is it not unusual, that a journo has access to, or knowledge of such information re the court appearance this week. Maybe if they are a court reporter, they are around the traps to be aware of different whispers re different hearings. I guess it is nice to know that suppressions can be ordered and reporters value their positions enough to abide by re rules.

        Perhaps the girls have tired of having to visit the outlaws tri-weekly. When are the next school holidays? Livi might be thinking she should have the girls during such occasions…to keep connectedness between the girls and the B-C family…. Perhaps the B-C seniors want them but the skulls hanging on the walls on the outside are a red flag for what might lie within…If Livi got access for more than the couple of days like the grandies, she would do so for the oldies to spend time debriefing, deprogramming and reprogramming the girls. It probably eats at them like a cancer, that they aren’t in charge of the girls, as opposed to the Dickies who are tasked with nurturing the girls.

        • Anyone can access the family court list for any day it seems but it looks like its only up for that day and disappears. So if a journo has got some smarts they would keep an eye on those lists for any proceedings that pertain to any one of the high profile cases for that state. They are available on the familycourt.gov.au web site. Under the circumstances and the fact that the BC family crew were on the scene before the police and removing stuff including the children in front of the police I would think it would raise some very serious questions about whether they should have access to those girls much at all at this point. It must be very hard for the Dickies to maintain a sense of sanity when they hand the children over for even the shortest possible time.

        • “…spend time debriefing, deprogramming and reprogramming the girls”……considering the circumstances.this would be a big concern Little Fish!
          The girls may well know a lot, so considering the ‘debriefing’ they had allegedly been subjected to in the past, intimidating them to not tell what they know or try and reprogram them to doubt themselves will be a big worry, considering not just murder but others being accessories seem a real possibility.

  34. Hypothetically, the children hold the keys to a great lot. Not only regarding the night in question, (no we weren’t here or yes we were) but also regarding how Daddy treated Mummy beforehand.
    So hypothetically, unless they are brainwashed or debriefed or whatever, the children’s testimony could determine the fate of the entire clan.
    And hypothetically, if the entire clan is so hell bent on their own self righteousness, self preservation, and upholding the ‘great and glorious” BC name; to the degree of showing NO care concern or consideration for Allison, (even when she was only missing), then IMO the children are at risk by merely being placed in their “care”.
    If Allison was expendable, are not the children more so?

    • I still can’t figure out what could be so important that GBC was allowed out of jail for a court hearing. If it was a custody thing he wouldn’t be required to appear under the circumstances, his lawyer could appear on his behalf. I still believe it is to do with the kids, otherwise why would OW have made the trek south again (and also in a private hearing), but what.

      • All will be revealed no doubt, in good time. One hopes that the powers that be (well those charged with determining custody issues), make the appropriate decisions regarding the children. Poor kids having been placed in this situation. Kids are mostly powerless in the adult world.

        Now I understand why people making such decisions have high security at their family homes, and their own children escorted to school etc as there are some baddens out there.

        It would no doubt eat away at the B-C’s that control of the children has been taken away from them.

        • I do recall the Dickies were given temporary custody, perhaps the end date for that order is looming. If GBC wasn’t happy then perhaps the order has been extended for the Dickies having custody, and so it should be.

          • I believe the Dickies have extra back-up in the form of another pseudo parent assisting. Their extended family are salt of the earth, genuinely caring, honest and decent people. It is a ‘pebble in the pond’ ripple effect whereby the network of live and support stretches far and wide. Their focus is on the best interests of the girls, whereas with Gerard’s family, their motives are unknown. Shooting themselves in their collective feet by bunkering down and not talking.

            Also, do we know if any of them have previous MO which would inform some of these decisions. Just asking and not casting aspersions.

  35. I asked a ‘wedgetailegal’ re the possibility of OW getting the girls and this was their comforting reply:

    “Unless the Dickies were really terrible carers, the court wouldn’t take the girls from grandparents in favour of an aunt. I’m surprised they even entertained an application from her (if that is what happened).
    Court won’t move children geographically unless there is a powerful reason, given that they have four grandparents locally plus their father, with whom they are entitled to have contact.”

    • Not to mention the Dickies actually moved house so the girls would be in the comfort zone amongst friends and dance activities. Was OW going to leave Townsville? A possibility if they were advised to be in the area the girls currently go to school/dance in, If the B-C grandparents were trying for custody OW wouldn’t need to be there. I am still bamboozled about GBC being allowed there, most prisoners don’t even get permission to attend a parent/child funeral.

      • I don’t know how these things work but in the eyes of the law is it a possibility that he is innocent until proven guilty, is that how he got timeout? He is no innocent in my eyes and I have major suspicions about some of the other family members also. When you see what just went down in Woolwich UK, you really have no idea who some people are inside but its only when these things happen that you begin to see things that just don’t add up. My personal view of the BC’s having skulls outside their house is extremely strange to say the least but then I prefer the finer things in life over skulls so maybe I’m the strange one.

        • A trip in a prison van into the holding cells at the court – then escorted up into the court room and return the same way – I don’t find that doing any favours or timeout.
          It wouldn’t have given chubby-chops any exercise other than for his jaws. Probably raised his blood pressure a bit tho…
          I wonder if the court he attended didn’t have video-conferencing available, so his presence was required – or am I just harking up the wrong tree…

        • Witchetad, skulls being a visual manifestation of death are creepy indeed as a home ‘decoration’….one wonders about the psychology of death (or is it the power of a hunter over life and death??) being used in such a public statement…

          • RIP …I think it’s kind of a trophy thing going on….i really don’t get it…hmmm but i do think there is some ‘power’ association going on with alll that displaying of skull stuffs……which makes sense….to the behaviour aspect anyways.

  36. Something that struck me: in the transcripts from GBC’s first 000 call, he was in his car somewhere presumably “looking for his wife”, but the children were at home.
    How often, I wonder, did the kids wake up and find themselves alone.

    Why didn’t he call the cops from home?
    Why did he go for a drive and call from somewhere away from the house.
    If you are looking for someone, you would of course wait until you got back home. She may have walked back home from a different direction and be home already. Thats what I would be thinking.
    Just make sure she hadn’t returned already before you call the cops.

    Another feeble attempt to throw the Police off in a different direction. Trying too hard to give his story credibility.

    FAIL

    • Yep theorist….I’m with you on that one….the timing there is all over the shop…in more ways than one…however…it is all some what circumstantial stuff still….wonder how much circumstantial tips the balance?

      Ozmosis….I think you’re right…I do recall there being temporary custody and yes….perhaps it was another ‘session’ to grant whatever custody is best suited for the girls……..looks like a good outcome if gerbs was looking displeased :)

      • Funny that the whole B-C’s fronted. No mention of the Dickies. One would think if it were a battle for custody, all parties would be required. Perhaps a special hearing.

        • hmmm dunno little fish…interesting wonderings though. I wonder too…..who will be callled as witnesses in this case….and whether that has any impact on custodianship…….

  37. “…spend time debriefing, deprogramming and reprogramming the girls”……
    Who’s to say this isn’t taking place already during the access visits? I don’t know how often the BC’s have access but it’s a worry.

      • Tri-weekly visits? That’s a lot. . .in anyone’s language. I wonder how the girls are coping with these disruptions, especially as (surely) they’d pick up on vibes that all is not hunky-dory between mum and dad’s families.

        • I think you will find that means once every 3 weeks. I have a feeling there was a lot of pre-arrest things happening. On the day GBC was arrested, he was taken to one police station and kids were collected from school and taken to another police station to await the arrival of the Dickies. Can’t tell me that wasn’t pre-planned in some way between child services/police etc. The B-C’s lived close by, had the kids living with them for a while after Allison’s disappearance and saw them regularly, so why were the Dickies called in? What we don’t know is more important than what we do know. And the what we don’t know stuff is probably still the reason that the Dickies have the kids.

          • Of course, once every 3 wks. That’s ok then :-)
            What you say is true, Ozmo, that what we DON’T KNOW is more important than what we DO KNOW. And I know very little.
            I recall someone here commenting on how the senior BCs marched through the school to see the girls, despite being told not to, and I’m still trying to understand what kind of people Allison and her family had to deal with, and what the police are now dealing with.

          • Yes Ozmo – Allison’s girls went to the top of the list of priorities by the powers that be and yet the B-C megalomania continues unabated.
            I feel like banging all the B-C heads together – when are they going to get it into their thick heads that it is not ‘all about them’; that the world doesn’t revolve around their petty little lives.

    • That is one of the most extraordinary essays – the parallels to this case are absolutely chilling. Not a happy read, but My God! Each and every one of the scenarios mirrors the Gerbil and his modus operandi in one way or another.
      Thank you SFA.

      • Good find SfA and GHS can’t agree more. Chilling. Evil incarnate. But that is only to relatively normal people, he clearly sees it very differently to have the gall to get up in court and say “I am not guilty your honour”. For a layman looking at the evidence that is available to the public GBCs case is absolutely pathetic and just so lame and that is without the possibility of even more shocking evidence that might appear in the court case. It appears a truth pill would be impossible to swallow and unacceptably bitter to someone like GBC. All we can hope for is simply justice for A and those three little cherubs.

    • Thank you SFA Good find and extraordinarily relevant. Chilling indeed. It most certainly is harrowing reading and “close to home” Every single case.
      Close to home also is that the victims didn’t recognize the mortal danger they were in, or living with.
      Even when their friends and acquaintances did.

  38. Monstrous Arrogance: Husbands Who Choose Murder over Divorce
    By Cynthia Lewis, Davidson College.
    © 2008 School of Criminal Justice, University at Albany
    Journal of Criminal Justice and Popular Culture, 15 (1), 2008.
    The following is the opening synopsis for your information. .
    ‘What possesses a husband to kill his wife when divorce is an available
    alternative? That is the question at the core of the following essay surveying about a
    dozen cases concerning husbands who have been convicted of killing their wives and
    whose motive appears to be that of avoiding at least one negative consequence of
    divorce, whether alimony, loss of child custody, or damage to reputation and standing in
    the community. Numerous shared elements among these compelling stories limn a
    profile of this specific kind of spousal murder, which is calculated, dispassionate, and
    abetted by a husband’s ability to dehumanize his wife’.

    Thanks Ozmosis. This whole article is well worth a read. Good find.

  39. You’re welcome Caro ;) As you say, GHS, so many parallels with the GBC case, it is chilling reading indeed. Parts of it that stand out for me are:

    * Perpetrators usually have another replacement waiting in the wings.
    * Possess a ‘gift’ for promoting themselves
    * “Devoid of feeling: icy and shrewd calculation, preservation of outward cool and well-being that relies on the family’s idealized image, and self-centredness”.
    * One mother of a victim of such a murder asked the question ‘why?’ And the answer was “He didn’t think he would get caught. He thought he’d get away with it.”
    * Chillingly, in some cases, the murder occurs in a fit of rage when the wife threatens to leave them.

    While reading the article it did strike me though, that I don’t think GBC was half as intelligent as some of perpetrators in the examples given, but nonetheless it goes a long way to explain many of GBC’s inexplicable actions for me…

    • Imagine choosing murder over “. . .damage to reputation and standing in
      the community.” Murder is the lesser evil?
      Thanks for the article, SfA. I seem to remember some of these cases from the Crime channel.

    • One of the murderers mentioned in that article is Jeffrey MacDonald. I found the background in Wikipedia, and found this little item mentioned in it which reminded me of a tip of a glove found in Allison’s clothing.
      “. . . The tips of surgical gloves were found beneath the headboard where “pig” was written in blood; they were identical in composition to a supply MacDonald kept in the kitchen.”
      Food for thought.

  40. Pay child support for the next 10 years????
    Noooo………… GBC never had divorce in mind
    Why did GBC commit Murder?

    One Word: Insurance Money

    Divorce meant that he would just be adding a new set of problems to go along with the ones he already had.
    Murder on the other hand meant a virtually debt free future (Insurance Money), no child support and a lot less problems with Allison permanently off the scene.
    Murder meant that he could continue with the lifestyle and the position in society he thought he deserved.
    All the planets came into alignment that night for GBC. This was it!
    He didn’t plan for anything to go wrong, he planned to get away with it.
    By now, GBC would have been happily partnered up with T McH taking turns to drive the kids to school, Saturday B-B-Q’s and Sunday at church.
    Most of his debts paid off from the insurance money, but first things first, the latest model -”Beloved Lexus”
    Yes, living it high on the hog, with his desk high on the hill at Taringa
    None of you Plebs would have been any the wiser

    If it wasn’t for those damn scratch marks!!!

    • The fact that Insurance companies don’t pay out for suicide is well known and wide spread. I don’t think GBC is any sort of Einstein, but I think he would have known that.
      The suicide theory only suits GBC now because it is his best chance of getting off the hook.
      I bet he was counting on the abduction/rape/murder theory in the beginning so as to secure the insurance.
      The fact that he tried to access the insurance money even before a Coroners report shows that the last thing he wanted anyone to believe was that it may have been suicide. He certainly believed it wasn’t suicide at the time.
      The suicide theory has come about because one of GBC’s legal advisors has been able to “Spin” a good story of suicide out of Allisons diary.

      • And by the way,
        How many people have committed suicide first thing in the morning after a good night sleep?
        Someone would have statistics about that somewhere.
        I bet there is not many.
        And how many suicides would walk such a long distance prior to doing themselves in?
        Jumping off a bridge is a common suicide, but the Mount Crosby Bridge isn’t high enough to be sure of it. You might break an arm or a leg, but you wouldn’t die.
        If it was drugs, then what drugs? Where’s the evidence?
        Nothing fits. The suicide theory just doesn’t work.
        For a woman who would rather stay married to a [email protected]$#@rd like GBC as opposed to the humiliation of divorce, the absolute last thing a woman like that would do is shame herself and her family by committing suicide.

        • I agree with much of your post theorist, however, I must zone in on your last sentence about bringing ‘shame’ to herself and her family through the act if suicide.

          I ain’t no expert, but it is not a word I associate with suicide. While I don’t entertain the suicide theory for a micro-second in Allison’s case, having lived through the suicide of a family member, shame is not an emotion or reaction I would attach to the person who in a moment of great pain took their life, nor to those they left behind.

          Happy Monday posters.

  41. OMG I’ve just found this thread! I was looking wondering why all was so quiet. I didn’t see there was a newy. Shut up! I can hear you laughing. LOL

    Who is the Hamburger Man?

    I feel Allison was caught up in a merry-go-round. She was played like a cat with a mouse. The ‘downs’ were horrid & lonely but when GBC wanted to reel her back in the ‘ups’ or the ‘honeymoon periods’ would outweigh the ‘downs’. Maybe he’d be ultra sweet when he wanted money from her side of the family. Handy to have them.
    With Stockholm Syndrome the captee begins to understand and believes in the captors reasons and actually begins to love. The captor feeds, houses and cares for the prisoner and possibly GBC convinced Allison she would not be able to survive without him.
    Allison was an intelligent woman but I feel her surroundings were wearing her down, let’s face it guys, not too many could cope with this mental torment for long. She was being tormented for sure and sometimes a woman in an abusive situation becomes happy that her husband has an affair so he leaves her and the children in peace, for a while because then comes the honeymoon period again. Crazy? Oh yes.
    I’m not saying Allison was kept a prisoner as such but I feel she was, at least, being mentally abused. Physically? Highly possible. Remember the bruise on her leg at the awards in the silver dress? That was a whopper bruise!!

    • These freaks of nature treat their wives terrible. They smother them in affection when they want to cover something up and threaten them when they complain. They do things like buy things for their wives to cover for the lies and send cards as surprises on special occasions to make everything appear fabulous. I reckon if you checked the phone records he probably even phoned his wife then his mistress just to settle the score for both and keep them both right where he wanted them.
      The suicide theory was a pathetic backup plan for GBC. If the last thing Allison did was leave those scratches all over his pathetic face and body then it is testament to what an incredibly smart lady she was. She wanted the world to know what a b%$^ard her husband really was.
      This was the epitome of evil.

  42. With some anti smoking medications you can’t suffer from depression.
    When my doctor asked if I’ve ever suffered depression I answered,
    ‘Yes, But I don’t anymore because I divorced him!’.
    Ha she thought that was very funny.
    I got the meds no probs.

  43. Yes theorist – those bloody scratches ruined everything. I’m so so sorry Allison was murdered but I think he could have got off Scott free if she didn’t lay open that butt ugly lying face.
    That’s why we’re here Allison because you are speaking to us from your resting place…….still.

  44. Hi SFA
    Your post dated May 26, 2013 at 4:41 pm, including the link, is so utterly relevant IMO; I was wondering if you might consider putting it on to the new thread.
    It seems worthy of discussion by itself. Been thinking about it since reading, and thought about all the things in common, another of which is; none of the perpetrators (including gbc) appear to be blatant on the street murderers. All wear a similar facade. Might be paper thin; but a facade nonetheless.
    I recall early in the peace the QPS were quick to allay the fears of the local community that their safety was not at risk. Meaning; there was a killer and that killer was not out to murder all and sundry.

    • Sorry to disappoint you QCL, however the 2008 Lewis article from the Journal of Criminal Justice and Popular Culture refers to crimes in the USA not Australian Crimes, so don’t belong on a separate thread here on Aussie Crims.

      I’ve joined in discussion of these cases last year on a US hosted site. It has also been discussed on the Baden-Clay web sleuths thread previously.

      • No, I meant the new thread started here, just over the page, thread VII, where there only 4 comments to date!
        Whether the article refers to crimes in USA or Australia or Timbuktu, is irrelevant.
        The character traits of the perpetrators are practically identical.
        Therein lie the answers to some important questions that were raised here in the beginning, on separate threads.
        The Means, Motive and Opportunity all spelled out quite clearly.

    • Yes, I remember that too QCL, that early on QPS said that locals did not need to fear a killer in their midst. Quite telling. It’s incredible how callous a human being can be when they no longer want their partner in their lives, isn’t it? Planning it all out, no doubt isolating their partner from friends and family and some going to great lengths to cover it all up afterwards. Wherever the cases in the article come from, they go a long way to explaining things in this case. What we struggle with is asking why, attempting reason and applying rational processes, whereas to a narcissist their reality IS normal.

  45. I’m imagining how hard it would be for the Dickies to take their grandchildren in to see the father who murdered their daughter and the childrens mum. To sit in a close space to a ‘happy little moment together’. I shudder to imagine. Could the court case be over visitation?

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